wakf board marriage certificate?

#1 Jul 15th, 2010, 15:57
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  • sid1234 is offline
#1
Hi, I just got a job in Germany and naturally I want to take my wife along. She will not be working. For the visa application, I need to prove that she is my wife. She is Indian, I am a US citizen, we are Muslims, we got married in Karnataka. We got a marriage certificate from the Karnataka State Board of Wakfs. We don't have a marriage certificate from the Registrar of Marriages under the Special Marriage Act... This would take a long time.
Is the Board of Wakfs marriage certificate good enough? I called the embassy but they told me that it will be decided at the interview. However I don't want to risk having her visa rejected. So any advice or experience? I found this news article:
http://www.hindu.com/2009/08/19/stor...1955140500.htm
Thanks
#2 Jul 15th, 2010, 22:11
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  • Haylo is offline
#2
The focus of this site is travel to and within India, we may have a member who happens to know the precise requirements for a German visa, or a member who thinks they do, but it's not really the site's area of expertise.
#3 Jul 15th, 2010, 22:41
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#3
I know nothing of German visas, but I can say this:

the Special Marriage Act is not relevant: it is for people of different religions or those who do not wish to have a religious marriage or to be bound by the conditions of the Act applying to their religion. If you were to marry under the Special Marriage Act, your marriage, reasons and methods of divorce, etc, would no longer be those of the Muslim law.

What, I suspect, is in your mind, is the registration of your marriage, which is available to Hindus, Muslims, etc, after your religious marriage. Yes: it is a good idea!

Please remember, though, that many, many, Indians, perhaps millions, have no paperwork more official than that of their temple, church or mosque, and that many of those travel or emigrate outside of India.

I wouldn't worry too much about it, but, to be on the safe side, be prepared with other evidence of your marriage.
#4 Jul 16th, 2010, 18:09
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#4

Residential Permits, Embassies, Consulates, and Trust Lawyers

Hi sid1234:

Below, you can find the copy of a file which I've downloaded from the website of the German embassy in Delhi. I don't know if the rules apply to your wife for you're not a German national, but it may give you some idea about what they expect at the embassy or one of the consulates.

You wrote that your wife was from Karnataka. So it's The German Consulate General at Bengaluru or that at Chennai which your wife might have to apply to:

http://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/diplo...tretungen.html

You may know that Germany has placed India among the countries which have "unsicheres Urkundenwesen". I don't how how to translate the latter - perhaps to "documentation of uncertain nature". The German consulates hire trust lawyers to verify the documents. It can take a long time - and the applicant must bear the costs - and not all trust lawyers are nice and work properly - I think you know that!

Good luck!

Copy of the file downloaded from the website of the German embassy in Delhi:

"
Updated: 27 May 2010

Visa application for family reunion and permanent residence in Germany

With effect from 17 March 2008, all applicants for a visa for family reunion and permanent residence in Germany have to schedule an appointment prior to submitting their application at the German Embassy in New Delhi.

For appointments and further information about service charges and the mode of payment please contact VFS Global Services Pvt. Ltd. in New Delhi or Chandigarh (tel: 011- 4253-0000 or website: www.vfs-germany.co.in/).

Every applicant has to submit his application in person at the Embassy. Minors have to be accompanied by their legal guardian or third person duly authorized by the legal guardian by presenting a written authorization attested by a notary public together with a valid photo-ID.

To apply for the visa the following documents have to be submitted as originals (in case a document is not written in English or German, it has to be submitted together with an English translation) together with three well legible sets of photocopies (size A 4) each.

1. two visa application forms duly completed

2. passport, valid for at least another year as of date of visa application

3. 4 passport size pictures according to biometric specifications (in case you cannot click onto the given link, please refer to our homepage)

4. copy of all pages of the spouse’s passport

5. visa fee to be paid by demand draft made out to the "Embassy of the Federal Republic of Germany" (in case you cannot click onto given link, please refer to our homepage)

6. if the marriage was performed according to the Hindu Marriage Act:
- marriage certificate
- temple certificate from the Mandir / Gurudwara
- conversion certificate, if applicable
- several photographs showing that the essential rites had been performed

7. if the marriage was performed according to Shariat Law:
- Nikahnama (signed by Qazi)
- several photographs showing that the essential rites had been performed

8. if the marriage was performed according to Special Marriage Act:
- marriage certificate

9. if the marriage was performed according to the Christian Marriage Act:
- marriage certificate
- church certificate
- conversion certificate, if applicable

10. birth certificate under the “Births and Deaths Registration Act”, 1969, if birth occurred on 01.04.1973 or later

11. "certificate of non-traceability of Entry in Birth Register/Not-Found-Certificate" in case the birth occurred before 01.04.1973 and a birth certificate cannot be issued or a late registration is not possible

12. matriculation certificate or Middle School Board Certificate or school leaving certificate including the date of birth

13. Ration Card of the applicant covering the last 4 years

14. Certificate of Residence of the spouse living in Germany. This Certificate must not be older than 6 months

15. Copy of the valid employment contract of the spouse living in Germany

16. Divorce and Custody Judgment and Decree from former spouse, if applicable

17. Certificate of acknowledgement of paternity, if applicable

18. Confirmation from Registrar of Births regarding illegitimacy of child, if applicable

19. Certificate of Death of the former spouse, if applicable

20. 15,000.00 Rupees investigation fee for the verification of all documents of Indian origin (to be paid by demand draft payable to the "Embassy of the Federal Republic of Germany"). The verification procedure will be initiated and carried out by the Embassy. The process of verification takes between 6 to 10 weeks.

21. Proof of sufficient knowledge of German language through an A-1 Level Certificate issued by the Goethe Institute (Max Mueller Bhavan). This Certificate must not be older than 12 months

22. Proof of sufficient knowledge of German language through a C-1 Level Certificate issued by the Goethe Institute (Max Mueller Bhavan) for minors aged between 16 and 18 years if they apply for a visa for family reunion with a non-German national. This Certificate must not be older than 12 months

Additional information regarding no. 21 and 22:

In principle the Embassy recognizes certificates from all German language schools which follow the standardized language test of the "Association of Language Testers in Europe (ALTE)". These language schools have to ensure that their language tests are undertaken by the schools' own teachers and that they employ native German teachers. Please note that at present in India only the Goethe Institute (Max Mueller Bhavan) fulfills these ALTE-requirements.

The Embassy reserves the right to request additional documents if necessary.

Please note that the Embassy will not process incomplete visa applications. The applicant will therefore have to re-schedule a new appointment through VFS only. The Embassy has no influence on the waiting list at VFS for visa applications.

You can download the following forms / declarations by clicking onto the links below:

• Application form for German National Residence Permit [pdf; 322.15 k]
• Declaration of True and Complete Information [pdf; 27.09 k]

For further general information please visit the website of the German Embassy at www.new-delhi.diplo.de.

No responsibility can be taken for the correctness of this information. 05/10"

Source: http://www.new-delhi.diplo.de/Vertre...t__Permit.html
Last edited by kela; Jul 16th, 2010 at 21:30..
#5 Jul 16th, 2010, 20:38
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#5
Thank you Kela and Nick-H !!!
Very helpful. May I ask a general question??? Many countries, for visa purposes, state on their information pages that they want a marriage certificate from the Registrar of Marriages. This seems to be the OFFICIAL way to go. That is my impression at least. Whatever the case, why is there no marriage certificate from the registrar for the Muslim Marriage Act? There is the Hindu Marriage Act certificate and the Special Marriage Act certificate, and a few others in some states of India. But why no Muslim certificate? The Special Marriage certificate takes at least 30 days (they post a notice and wait for objections) but the Hindu Act does not have this long waiting time. That raises another question that I'd like to ask... why is there this waiting period for the Special Marriage Act?
#6 Jul 16th, 2010, 20:47
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#6
The certificate for the hindu marraige act is just a certificate for the marraige which has already been conducted between a hindu bride and a hindu groom as per hindu rites.

For the special marriage act the wedding itself has a 30 day waiting period after the notice is given. its not a waiting period for the crtificate. The wedding ceremony has no religious part and is just a signing of papers infront of a registrar. You usually get the certificates within 1-2 days of that signing(in case the registrar came to your place for the signing).
#7 Jul 16th, 2010, 21:33
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#7
To reiterate: the Special Marriage Act thing is a wedding ceremony in itself.

Some people may choose religious or self-made ceremonies that have no legal standing, and have their legal marriage under the Special Act. People all over the world do this sort of thing.

Nayan (or anyone?)... Just checking... I know that Hindu weddings can be and are registered by the registrar, I've even seen the registrar come to posh weddings and do the paperwork on site. Same thing applies to Muslim weddings?

I know that objection from some Muslim communities (who feel it is their authority, not that of the government, to administer such family matters) is stalling compulsory marriage registration, but there is nothing to stop muslims registering, if they wish, is there?

If I need correcting on this, please, somebody, chime in: it would help me in case I give wrong advise in the future.
#8 Jul 16th, 2010, 21:37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick-H View Post Nayan (or anyone?)... Just checking... I know that Hindu weddings can be and are registered by the registrar, I've even seen the registrar come to posh weddings and do the paperwork on site. Same thing applies to Muslim weddings?
As far as I know, the muslim wedding is performed by a kazi who issues the nikahnamah(the muslim marriage certificate).

I have no idea about registerting with the govt registrar in case of muslim weddings.
#9 Jul 16th, 2010, 22:05
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sid1234 View Post Is the Board of Wakfs marriage certificate good enough? I called the embassy but they told me that it will be decided at the interview.
I know nothing about getting a German visa, but on a general point, the German embassy will be seeing many many proofs of Indian marriage every day, and they must have a policy about what is and what is not acceptable.

When I hear of someone being told "It will be decided at the interview" when talking about something as basic as whether a certain marriage certificate is acceptable, that says to me that they are talking to a very junior member of staff who does not know about these things, and who is taking the easy way out of answering.

You could try calling again and asking to speak to someone more senior who will be able to answer your question.If you do, ensure that you take their name and job title.
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#10 Jul 17th, 2010, 00:47
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#10
Thanks Haylo, I will take up your advice and call them again.

But now I am curious about the registration question in general. Thanks for the clarification Nayan and Nick-H. You explained that the Special Marriage act is a wedding itself. And that is its purpose. It can also be used to issue a marriage certificate for a marriage that has already taken place. In that case there is still a 30 day waiting period. Now since for most states there are just these two Marriage Act Certificates (Hindu and Special) available with the registrar of marriages, Muslims have no alternative, when they want to register with the government registrar, but to go for the Special one and that involves a long waiting period.
#11 Jul 17th, 2010, 01:33
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#11
Didn't know that --- as is obvious!
#12 Jul 17th, 2010, 12:44
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#12
Very interesting reading 21 and 22 of the visa requirements posted by kela. Same as what U.K proposes to do, the germans have quietly done so.
#13 Sep 9th, 2011, 20:20
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  • mhmdriaz is offline
#13

WAKF Marriage cert for German dependent visa.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sid1234 View Post Hi, I just got a job in Germany and naturally I want to take my wife along. She will not be working. For the visa application, I need to prove that she is my wife. She is Indian, I am a US citizen, we are Muslims, we got married in Karnataka. We got a marriage certificate from the Karnataka State Board of Wakfs. We don't have a marriage certificate from the Registrar of Marriages under the Special Marriage Act... This would take a long time.
Is the Board of Wakfs marriage certificate good enough? I called the embassy but they told me that it will be decided at the interview. However I don't want to risk having her visa rejected. So any advice or experience? I found this news article:
http://www.hindu.com/2009/08/19/stor...1955140500.htm
Thanks
I have the Same exact Situation except that me & my wife are Indian National, did you find a way out of this situation, appreciate if you can spare a min to post you soultion. unfortunately i dont have time to wait and need to aapply for visa in 2 days with the wakf marriage certificate.
#14 Sep 9th, 2011, 22:31
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#14
Saying you have the exact same situation doesn't help much, because there are some differences which may be pertinent.

Please look at pt.no 7 in post 4 above posted by @kela. Unless the rules haven't changed and you are applying for a German Visa (Shenzen), I think it still applies.

In any case look here: http://www.vfs-germany.co.in

OK, just googled and came across this here: http://www.vfs-germany.co.in/south/i...%20Spouses.pdf

Quote:
your Marriage Certificate (registered document only, religious certificates will not be accepted, A4 sized copy)
Also any Marriage registered with the Registrar of Marriages doesn't have to be under the Special Marriage Act, it can be under any Marriage law.
#15 Sep 9th, 2011, 23:00
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  • Nick-H is offline
#15
Indeed. A Special Marriage Act registration is a wedding ceremony (albeit unceremonious) in itself. It is a complete, self-contained marriage. You cannot register an existing marriage under the Special Marriage Act.

For the other, religious, marriages, you register the fact that the wedding has taken place, under the relevant Act.

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