Guide to getting Stay visa for child born in India to foreign passport holder

#16 Apr 16th, 2018, 19:38
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#16
The language of the constitution, the experience of the person I quoted who had OK from the FRRO for having to passports from his/her child (“clueless” in your esteemed opinion) point to the validity of my point. You are going by “known fact that has happened to a lot of people.” I am sure we are supposed to bow to your superior knowledge of such facts.

My point was not about passport but the dual citizenship rights of a minor. And, that is not disputed by anything you have said. The Immihelp link I gave in my earlier post (outside of the specific thread I linked) contains a number of threads with much more informed and legal opinions on the topic. That a parent does not / did not claim it for their child is a matter of convenience or attitude towards the value of Indian citizenship is their decision - not the legal options available to them should they assert child’s right to dual citizenship.
#17 Apr 16th, 2018, 19:43
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#17
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Originally Posted by wolf80 View Post In this circumstance you first have to regularise your stay in India by applying for an entry X visa. Then you are eligible to apply for OCI. Lon gterm visa is a mandatory document before you can apply for OCI from within India.
Got it. I can't remember what we did with my daughter. We were out of India for her birth but went back when she was 2 months old. I think we got her PIO straight away before we moved back.
#18 Apr 16th, 2018, 19:55
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#18
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Originally Posted by kmalik View Post The language of the constitution, the experience of the person I quoted who had OK from the FRRO for having to passports from his/her child (“clueless” in your esteemed opinion) point to the validity of my point. You are going by “known fact that has happened to a lot of people.” I am sure we are supposed to bow to your superior knowledge of such facts.

My point was not about passport but the dual citizenship rights of a minor. And, that is not disputed by anything you have said. The Immihelp link I gave in my earlier post (outside of the specific thread I linked) contains a number of threads with much more informed and legal opinions on the topic. That a parent does not / did not claim it for their child is a matter of convenience or attitude towards the value of Indian citizenship is their decision - not the legal options available to them should they assert child’s right to dual citizenship.
I don't understand how a child can travel out of India on a U.S. passport and into India on an Indian passport. Do you have any information about this? Wouldn't there be a disconnect with immigration somewhere?

Also - I don't understand the point of a minor having 2 passports if they can make a decision which citizenship they want at 16/18. What would be the benefits?

Thanks for your insight.
#19 Apr 16th, 2018, 20:27
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#19
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Originally Posted by kmalik View Post The language of the constitution, the experience of the person I quoted who had OK from the FRRO for having to passports from his/her child (“clueless” in your esteemed opinion) point to the validity of my point. You are going by “known fact that has happened to a lot of people.” I am sure we are supposed to bow to your superior knowledge of such facts.

My point was not about passport but the dual citizenship rights of a minor. And, that is not disputed by anything you have said. The Immihelp link I gave in my earlier post (outside of the specific thread I linked) contains a number of threads with much more informed and legal opinions on the topic. That a parent does not / did not claim it for their child is a matter of convenience or attitude towards the value of Indian citizenship is their decision - not the legal options available to them should they assert child’s right to dual citizenship.
Did you even read Immihelp? Yes, theoretically, a minor can hold an Indian passport and also another country's, but their parents end up paying hefty fines or get stuck in India for a few days frantically writing letters. It's not my superior knowledge you should bow to, but to Immihelp. This is the thread with both lofty theory (your POV) and crashing down to earth reality (my POV):

https://www.immihelp.com/forum/showt...below-18-Years

Note that the only two real-life experiences in that thread have been resoundingly negative.

So, really... Don't. Do. It. Never apply for Indian passport while holding another country's.

PS: And yes, the FRRO reply you originally linked to really was clueless. It's 18 years old, not 16. Even if it's a typo, it still shows how seriously they take their jobs. I've personally observed FRRO people telling Chinese wives to apply for PIO.
#20 Apr 16th, 2018, 20:31
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#20
This is a response to Pani Puri.

No. My wife is a dual citizen and does travel out of India using one of her passports and enters the other countries using (possibly) different passport. In fact, she has entered India on one country’s passport in the past (as it was connected to PIO) and more recently on a different country passport (on her OCI). The officer on IGI could see it but did not bat an eye.

I say possibly exit a country on one passport and enter the next country on a different passport because if you are a dual passport holder and are entering one of the countries of which you have a passport, you are supposed to use that country’s passport.
#21 Apr 16th, 2018, 21:39
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#21
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Originally Posted by kmalik View Post This is a response to Pani Puri.

No. My wife is a dual citizen and does travel out of India using one of her passports and enters the other countries using (possibly) different passport. In fact, she has entered India on one country’s passport in the past (as it was connected to PIO) and more recently on a different country passport (on her OCI). The officer on IGI could see it but did not bat an eye.

I say possibly exit a country on one passport and enter the next country on a different passport because if you are a dual passport holder and are entering one of the countries of which you have a passport, you are supposed to use that country’s passport.
Thanks. I have relatives with dual citizenship but none with an Indian passport and that of another country and they travel that way as well.

I was wondering about a child having an Indian passport and that of another country. With our past experiences with FRRO/Indian immigration I couldn't see complicating the situation trying to enter on an Indian passport after leaving on a different passport. Too often officials really have no idea of the law and you will get different answers to the same question. The last thing I'd want to deal with after a 16 hour flight is some nonsense from immigration.
#22 Apr 16th, 2018, 21:51
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#22
Pani Puri,

What do you mean leaving on a different passport? A dual citizen leaves on the same passport he/she entered the country on - which, for an Indian (dual) citizen entering India would be Indian passport. The airline may need to see the foreign passport to confirm the ability of that person to gain entry to the destination country.
#23 Apr 17th, 2018, 01:05
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#23
An informed discussion of the topic, in the US/India dual citizenship context:

http://www.r2iclubforums.com/forums/...n-(USC-and-IC)
#24 Apr 17th, 2018, 01:09
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#24
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Originally Posted by kmalik View Post Pani Puri,

What do you mean leaving on a different passport? A dual citizen leaves on the same passport he/she entered the country on - which, for an Indian (dual) citizen entering India would be Indian passport. The airline may need to see the foreign passport to confirm the ability of that person to gain entry to the destination country.
Ohhh, got it. So leaving India on Indian passport and entering US on US passport. Leaving US on US passport and arriving India on Indian passport. And leaving US you absolutely would have to show your Indian passport.

And after all that...why? Although I am a bit intrigued by getting an Indian passport for my daughter. Surely can't be as difficult as converting her PIO to OCI.
#25 Apr 17th, 2018, 01:34
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#25
Nothing with Indian bureaucracy is easy... Do read and inform yourself about the rights as well as the challenges. Matka is not wrong in highlighting the situations you may run into. There are a number of fairly well informed discussions on the internet. The last link I posted has some very good discussion.

It is clear that a lot of babus in India don't know the legal situation well and can cause a problem. So, flashing your foreign passport in India is not a good idea, but you are well within the Indian legal framework in having a child with dual citizenship.

[BTW - flashing a different country passport in any country where you are a citizen is a bad idea. Even countries which do not have a problem with dual citizenship react badly to that. So, don't use the Indian passport in the US and the US passport in India, if you (child) are a citizen of both countries.]
#26 Apr 17th, 2018, 14:05
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#26
Generally, if you have two (or more) citizenships, you have to enter those countries with the respective passport and you will be only treated like a citizen of the country you are in. Let´s say I am a citizen of Germany and the US. I have to (!) enter Germany with my German passport and I will be treated as a German. In case, I face a problem, where embassies usually help, the US embassy would not (!) help me.
In all other countries (besides in this example Germany and the US), I can choose with which passport I enter and I can also contact both embassies in case of an emergency.
#27 Apr 17th, 2018, 14:43
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#27
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Originally Posted by Pani Puri View Post Ohhh, got it. So leaving India on Indian passport and entering US on US passport. Leaving US on US passport and arriving India on Indian passport. And leaving US you absolutely would have to show your Indian passport.

And after all that...why? Although I am a bit intrigued by getting an Indian passport for my daughter. Surely can't be as difficult as converting her PIO to OCI.
I remember being told when I applied for my daughter's Indian passport that she is ineligible if she holds another passport. Luckily we got her Indian passport first, then her Japanese passport. When we applied for stay visa on her Japanese passport at FRRO, we were verbally told to return the Indian passport to passport office. But when I asked the head person at FRRO, she said it's not mandatory as she is a minor. I ended up keeping her indian passport but now that she has OCI, I don't think I'll ever use it until it expires in 2021. I wonder if it's even possible to renew her indian passport as a OCI holder?
#28 Apr 17th, 2018, 17:29
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#28
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Originally Posted by mamoru01 View Post I remember being told when I applied for my daughter's Indian passport that she is ineligible if she holds another passport. Luckily we got her Indian passport first, then her Japanese passport. When we applied for stay visa on her Japanese passport at FRRO, we were verbally told to return the Indian passport to passport office. But when I asked the head person at FRRO, she said it's not mandatory as she is a minor. I ended up keeping her indian passport but now that she has OCI, I don't think I'll ever use it until it expires in 2021. I wonder if it's even possible to renew her indian passport as a OCI holder?
That's an interesting situation. I don't think you can renew with an OCI.

I really would not go through the hassle of getting my daughter a passport - I don't see any point at this time. That can be her choice when she's old enough to make it.
#29 Apr 17th, 2018, 19:47
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#29
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Originally Posted by mamoru01 View Post I remember being told when I applied for my daughter's Indian passport that she is ineligible if she holds another passport. Luckily we got her Indian passport first, then her Japanese passport. When we applied for stay visa on her Japanese passport at FRRO, we were verbally told to return the Indian passport to passport office. But when I asked the head person at FRRO, she said it's not mandatory as she is a minor. I ended up keeping her indian passport but now that she has OCI, I don't think I'll ever use it until it expires in 2021. I wonder if it's even possible to renew her indian passport as a OCI holder?
Ideally you should surrender Indian passport before applying for OCI.
#30 Apr 17th, 2018, 20:10
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#30
But, since she has an OCI - it is best to let the sleeping dogs lie. The endeavor to surrender it might create more problems...

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