natural death in cows and eating beef

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#1 Nov 4th, 2009, 23:32
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#1
Hello everyone.

I've read several threads about eating cows, but I've done a search and haven't found an answer some very specific questions.

I'm aware that the vast majority Hindu population of India don't slaughter cows for comsuption like in the West.

But I read a book from A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada from the Hare Krshna movement a while back.

Prabhupada says that " You can eat a cow, only if she died of natural causes".

His reason is that he believes that humans reincarnate in cows,and when a cow is killed, the reincarnation is ended violently. If the cow dies naturally (egld age),the reincarnated spirit leaves and the dead flesh is safe to eat.

He goes on saying that the slaughtering of cows around the world is what causes all the pain and suffering in the world.

Now,I'm a Christian( not religious,mainly cultural) and I eat beef sometimes, but I respect Brabhupadas's beliefs, even thou I'm not a Hindu and don't believe that people reincarnate in cows.

Now, my questions are:

1) Do Hindus object to eating cow at all? or just cows that have been slaughtered for comsuption?


2) Can a Hindu person eat a cow that has died of natural causes(like old age)? or is still prohibited for Hindus/Jains to eat cow meat at all??

3) can a non-Hindu eat a cow in India as long as she has died of natural causes,and the people are not going to frown on you just because you are eating cow meat?


4) If is ok to eat a natural-death cow in India, Does the butcher must be a non-hindu/jain/Dharmic??


Ok, I know that there are many types of beliefs within Hinduism, I'm not sure if Prabhupada's belief one of the universal belief within the Hindu philosophy, or just a beliefs with some Hindus.

I'll appreciate your answers, thanx.
#2 Nov 4th, 2009, 23:52
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#2
Quote:
Originally Posted by the navigator View Post Hello everyone.

I've read several threads about eating cows, but I've done a search and haven't found an answer some very specific questions.

.
What was Mad Cow Disease that started in Europe and England few years back? Is this disease eradicated now? How it affected the Human population there.

For your other questions Aupmanyu, Paleface and few other esteemed members could answer you in better way.
#3 Nov 5th, 2009, 00:08
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the navigator...

India is a big place.

Not all Indians are Hindu.

Not all Hindus are vegetarian anyway.

None the less, slaughter of cows is restricted, and is legal in Bengal and Kerala only, which leads to cows being transported huge distances in cruel conditions. I don't know, but I doubt that anyone would want to eat a cow that died of old age.

Lots of beef is available in India. Lots of leather, also is worn.

A non-Hindu can eat what they want: you will find beef in a non-Hindu restaurant. It may be offensive to some Hindus, but it happens. It wouldn't be nice to take your beef sandwich into a Hindu house!

The musings of any particular "swamy" may be right, or not: they may also have some relation to what happens in India --- or not.

Beware extrapolating "India" from the sayings of one man, or the teachings or ways of one group.

I'd say that that is a fair practical reponse. As cityMonk says, there are those better qualified to discuss the scriptutal bases, if you so desire!
#4 Nov 5th, 2009, 00:14
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#4
Killing a cow and eating beef both are a big no no in hinduism.
Hindus dont eat cow even if she died of natural cause. In several Indian states sale of beef is banned but then several other states do allow it.
Most of us dont know the reason as mentioned in the scriptures but we are taught to adress cow as "gau mata" meaning mother.
Hindu butchers donot entertain butchering a cow..dead or alive.
Jainism which is a different religion altogether discourages any kind of violence so a cow gets automatically avoided and so does chicken and goats.

I just have a query emanating from your continuous stressing on consumption of dead animal..
Are dead animals slaughtered for consumption..Nobody who knows that the animal was already dead before the knife did him would like to avoid such meat..atleast I would.
I woulnt like consuming an animal who died of old age because I think the body tissue would already be pretty much 'dead' before the animal actually died
#5 Nov 5th, 2009, 00:16
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A thing with eating animals that have died of natural causes (i.e., old age indeed) is by that time they won't taste very good, and rather wiry.

Which is why us humans tend to eat them at a younger age. For which they generally need to be (bred and) slaughtered.

So eating just those that had died of old age, while a romantic and humane-sounding proposition as such, is in practice rather a moot point.
#6 Nov 5th, 2009, 00:32
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Originally Posted by machadinha View Post A thing with eating animals that have died of natural causes (i.e., old age indeed) is by that time they won't taste very good, and rather wiry.

Which is why us humans tend to eat them at a younger age. For which they generally need to be (bred and) slaughtered.

So eating just those that had died of old age, while a romantic and humane-sounding proposition as such, is in practice rather a moot point.
Unless ofcourse they died of a heart attack
#7 Nov 5th, 2009, 00:42
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Hm, yes. Leads to questions of raised adrenalin levels though

(Hmmm, I'm now picturing myself going Booh!! to some poor lamb Or to my carrots then, hey, never to worry, I don't eat meat.)
#8 Nov 5th, 2009, 02:46
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1) I have found nothing in the hindu scriptures that forbids the killing and eating of cows. If anyone has a quote, I would love to see it.


2) No hindu is prohibited from doing anything as it is not an organized religion. Sure, there are guidelines.. most of these are made up by the religious leaders.

3) Muslims are prohibited from eating non-halal meat products. So, if the cow slaughter is not halal, they are generally prohibited from consuming the meat.

4) No one checks the butcher's religion. But, in my experience, most of them have been muslim.

The main reason non-veg is frowned upon due to the fact that is results in the killing of another being. The eating meat from an animal that has died from natural causes or otherwise is a loophole that allows one to consume the meat without actually being reason for the death. Some monks will accept non-veg food that is given away for the same reason. Even Buddha used to eat meat which qualified as listed above.
#9 Nov 5th, 2009, 11:42
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[QUOTE=de_cooky;852703] In several Indian states sale of beef is banned but then several other states do allow it.

Most of the Eateries in India like Pizza Hut, Pizza Corner, KFC advertise that they dont sell Beef & Pork

[QUOTE=de_cooky;852703]
Hindu butchers donot entertain butchering a cow..dead or alive.

Hindu Butchers dont even go near Meat. They will only Cut Chicken.
#10 Nov 5th, 2009, 21:58
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#10

Be careful about beef in India

There is a very good reason to be careful about beef in India that
one should be aware of. Much (if not most) of Indian beef is obtained
not from animals raised for that purpose. Rather, it is obtained
from animals sold off at the end of their useful lives, --- yes,
even by the super sensitive Hindu owners, conveniently turning a
blind eye towards the future of the sacred animals. As a result,
the beef obtained is far from of prime quality, and frequently,
are from animals near the end of their lives, or even sick animals.
There is minimal quality control from the concerned authorities.
As a result health problems in consuming public are not rare.
Higher quality establishments may have better source, but one
never knows.
#11 Nov 6th, 2009, 02:21
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#11
Some info in beef production in India: http://www.agriculture-industry-indi...falo-meat.html
#12 Nov 6th, 2009, 02:29
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#12
I have a feeling that might be a link I don't want to click on --- even though I don't eat it. A bad case of rather-not-know .
#13 Nov 6th, 2009, 04:01
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#13
Quote:
Originally Posted by cityMONK View Post What was Mad Cow Disease that started in Europe and England few years back? Is this disease eradicated now? How it affected the Human population there.

For your other questions Aupmanyu, Paleface and few other esteemed members could answer you in better way.
It was a disease that affected cattle but no one really knows its origins. They know the vector was through feeding living cows with dead cows, and other live stock. A terrible example of playing with nature simply to reduce the costs. When the disease was transmitted to humans, it was known as vCJD. The disease has a very long incubation period, around four years. This explains why people were dying long after farming regulations were brought inline with common sense. As for affecting the human population, it does not quite translate to millions of mad Europeans, but some reckon the wider affects of the disease are yet to appear.
#14 Nov 6th, 2009, 13:52
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They know the vector was through feeding living cows with dead cows, and other live stock. A terrible example of playing with nature simply to reduce the costs.
The disease came, I think, originally from sheep. Meat pressure-extracted from central-nervous tissue, eg spine area, was used in cow feed. Cost cutting, for which the path was cleared by Margaret Thatcher --- may she never be forgiven for all eternity.
#15 Nov 18th, 2009, 19:48
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#15
Quote:
Originally Posted by the navigator View Post 1) Do Hindus object to eating cow at all? Or just cows that have been slaughtered for consuption?
2) Can a Hindu person eat a cow that has died of natural causes(like old age)? Or is still prohibited for Hindus/Jains to eat cow meat at all?
3) Can a non-Hindu eat a cow in India as long as she has died of natural causes, and the people are not going to frown on you just because you are eating cow meat?
4) If is ok to eat a natural-death cow in India? Does the butcher must be a non-hindu/jain/Dharmic?
1) Most hindus would not eat beef. In many parts of India cow-slaughter is prohibited. Where it is not, it means there are people who eat beef.
2) Natural causes will also include some disease, which will make it unedible. If the cow is old, then the beef, I think, would not be tasty. Most hindus will not eat beef in any case, and jains are supposed to abstain from all non-veg. food.
3) There is no stipulation for a non-hindu to abstain from eating beef in India. People will not frown at you. What you do is not their business.
4) Hindus will not butcher cows, and there are no jain butchers.
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