Yet another expat moving to work in Gurgaon!!!

#1 Sep 4th, 2010, 17:38
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  • Bellestie is offline
#1
Dear all

I would firstly like to say thank you to the founders of this site ...and of course the contributors for an amazing amount of helpful information.

I have read through a lot of the threads on here and thought it would be best to post my own and ask a few questions - mostly to put my mind at rest and so I can hit the ground running when I arrive.

Here is my story : Male, nearly 30 years old, been living in the UK for the last 11 years. Enjoy(s) warm weather, cricket, socializing, travelling, work (believe it or not, fishing, tennis, squash, swimming. I have been to Gurgaon 3 times but only for 1 or 2 week stretches - work related - so not travelled around a lot

For work, I am moving permanently to work in our office - in DLF cybercity - unfortunately working UK hours as a hands on consultant in our callcentre. I estimate I will clear (after tax) just over 1 lakh per month. I have to support myself i.e rent, travel (although cabs to work are paid for), I also get medical cover.

Having read threads here, some say this is OK, some don't. I have another income from abroad but I don't want to include this as part of my budget as I hope to save it.

My estimations so far (please correct me if I am wrong) are:

Rent 25,000 (can pay up to 30,000)
Bills (Electric, water, internet, sat tv, phone)10,000

Which leaves around 75,000 for food, enjoyment, personal travel, maid, driver?

I need to make the call between South Delhi and Gurgaon but as I work 'silly' hours, I think it would be better to live close to work in Gurgaon and travel to Delhi on the weekends. I have spent ages on the net and found that in Gurgaon, there are a series of 'colonies' or 'communities'. I hope to find one with a few green spaces, swimming pool, gym, do you think that would be realistic for my estimations above? Also, please can anyone advise which colonies are the best (within my budget) and which I should stay away from. My company will put me up for a few months but then I must make my own way. Also, for my budget, would the apartments be smart?

Having 75,000 rupees per month after rent & bills, what type of lifestyle do you think I may be able to live? Do you think it would be affordable for me to hire a driver, and if so should I hire one already with a car (cost please?) or buy a car and then hire a driver (cost and insurance implications please?). Also, living in these communities, is it possible to 'share' a maid with other apartments?

Many thanks and any advice or information will be much appreciated.
#2 Sep 4th, 2010, 20:10
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  • curtdfw is offline
#2
I'm also in the BPO biz, and lived in Gurgaon four about four years, 2004-2008. If you haven't seen it, do read my sort of wordy post #5 here. You might also join Yuni-Net and Gurgaon Connection.
“She was not quite what you would call refined. She was not quite what you would call unrefined. She was the kind of person that keeps a parrot.” – Mark Twain
#3 Sep 4th, 2010, 20:17
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  • Bellestie is offline
#3
Hi

Thanks for the reply. Yep - have joined Yuni.net already!

The main reason why I ask about accommodation (have spent hours on 99acres etc) is that they all lack pictures or just show pictures of the outside. Do you think that accomodation for around the 25,000 region will be upmarket?

Quote:
If you haven't seen it, do read my sort of wordy post #5 here.
That was a great and informative post of yours!

Thanks again
#4 Sep 4th, 2010, 20:27
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  • dillichaat is offline
#4
Here's my take, very briefly. I'm a european expat posted to Delhi 2 years ago, keep in mind that the advice you'll get, especially about the salary is highly subjective.

Rent @ 25000/month is very low, you should at least double that budget. I don't know Gurgaon but in South Delhi it's impossible if you want anything decent approaching western comfort, good power supply and AC.

Gurgaon or Delhi: Gurgaon is cheaper than south Delhi. Given your working hours however, you'd miss peak traffic so living in south Delhi and working in Gurgaon should be feasible but beware the rental prices. To give you an idea: I live in a very good area and have a large apartment but it costs my employer 300000 Rs/month and it's not a palace.
AC: During the summer months (april-july), we pay about 12000/month for the electricity alone and we use AC sparingly because we tolerate the heat. TV is very cheap, couple of 1000 per year for a normal package. Phone is also not expensive if you stick to a basic package. Internet: all across the board, from 1000/month for a slow, limited connection to 5000 for my all bells and whistles 100 Gb/month 15 Mbps deal.

Maid: if you go for a part time maid, it will cost between 2000 to 4000/month. Driver will be between 7000 and 11000. I have a deal where I rent a car + driver 8 hours/day, every day. Costs my employer about 30000/month.

Food is not expensive IF (big 'if') you can stick to local produce and don't drink alcohol. You'll only be able to purchase and register a car if you're a resident but that shouldn't be a problem. Insurance is cheap but virtually useless. Going out can be expensive, my wife and I went for a bite a a drink last weekend and it came to 5000/head without doing anything excessive.

How about health insurance? Very important to sort this out.

My idea about the financial package (as I said, highly subjective): I wouldn't do it for that money. What counts is not just what you make here compared to local standards but also what you'll be able to take back home once your mission here is over. But then again, I'm in the game for the money, your mileage may vary.
"It is preferable to have a criminal for a servant rather than a fool because a criminal's actions are predictable and you can protect yourself against them, whereas there is no telling what a fool's next move will be.
#5 Sep 4th, 2010, 20:47
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  • Bellestie is offline
#5
Hi dillichaat

Thank you for an excellent reply.

Half my salary will be paid in the UK and half paid in India which like I said is in the region of 110,000 rupees after tax - which is what I was hoping to live off - and save my UK salary. Well at least, that is the goal!

The reason why I brought up the figure of 25,000 for rent is that on megabricks and 99acres, there seems to be a lot of 'nice sounding' properties for that rate in some decent sounding colonies - but again nor backed up with pictures or anything. All I am looking for is a 2 or 3 bed apartment in a secure area hopefully in a community where there is a club,pool,gym. I saw several properties advertised in places such as Heritage, Essel, Princetown, Nirvana (in Gurgaon) and some others for 25,000ish - do you think that those are scam adverts?

Yep, I have seen Delhi is far more expensive, think that may be why I may choose Gurgaon and travel to Delhi on weekends.

Quote:
How about health insurance? Very important to sort this out.
Luckily health insurance and medical expenses are all covered.

I have of course been given advice by colleagues who work out there but have so far found the information on here much more useful and realistic - thanks again.
#6 Sep 4th, 2010, 20:50
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  • natvista is offline
#6
The nearest good option from your office place will be at DLF city pahse 2 this is within 1.5 kms from ur office. But apart from some residential complexes out there you will not get swimmimg pool/ tenis courts. The rent starts here at around 25000(unfurnished) but a decent one (semi furnished with AC) shall cost you in the range of 45000 to 50000. this is with 100% power back up wich is the most important criteria for selecting a house at gurgaon. If you want to have + swimming pool and other facilities ready to pay atleaset 60000.

A slightly cheaper option is DLF city phase 4, city centre and others but be ready to travel 10kms in busy trafic every day.
#7 Sep 4th, 2010, 20:52
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  • dillichaat is offline
#7
Quote:
The reason why I brought up the figure of 25,000 for rent is that on megabricks and 99acres, there seems to be a lot of 'nice sounding' properties for that rate in some decent sounding colonies - but again nor backed up with pictures or anything. All I am looking for is a 2 or 3 bed apartment in a secure area hopefully in a community where there is a club,pool,gym.
Not a scam per se but local expectations about lodging tend to be much different from what a foreigner wants. Also, never trust any ad unless you've seen the property yourself and checked the power supply/water supply situation. I can't help you with prices in Gurgaon but I'm positive that 25000 for what you want in south Delhi is utterly impossible. Will try to post some more but gotta run now, my wife is ordering me to get ready for a restaurant visit.
#8 Sep 4th, 2010, 21:37
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  • Manzey is offline
#8
You can get unfurnished two bedroom flat in a gated community with swimming pool, gym and clubhouse for Rs 17-25k in Gurgaon. Semifurnished or furnished will be more expensive.

Cheers!
#9 Sep 4th, 2010, 21:47
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#9
Bellestie, I have a better idea about Delhi rents not Gurgaon, but just from reading IM, I'd budget at least Rs. 50,000 for housing for the reasons dillichaat gave - quality of the place, power back-up, and other amenities. For Delhi, you'd need at least twice that number.
#10 Sep 4th, 2010, 23:31
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#10
Quote:
Originally Posted by namaste_cat View Post Rs. 50,000



if you can afford 2 hours daily to and fro Noida, it can halve your housing budget
triyund, tungnathji, valley of flowers
#11 Sep 5th, 2010, 01:38
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  • :agentsmith: is offline
#11
Hey Bellestie,

First of all i wanna tell you that i registered on this site just to reply to your question as i thought i could help you a little bit WHY?
Coz I live in Gurgaon.
I think i can answer almost all of your queries
So lets start
First off all Appartment- I think it is pretty manageable in your budget(M not sure though), Try heritage city that seems like the best place for you has a lot of parks and 100% power backup too.
Now to bills Electric bills can cost you anything around 10000 if you use all the standard equipments plus A.C. for lets say 6 hours a day.
Internet- 3000 for 2mbps unlimited
Water - less than 500 per month
Phone - well that just depends on how much you call(call rates are pretty cheap).
Sat tv connection - less than 500
Food if you Stick to near by restaurants around heritage city, u can enjoy a really great meal for 500 max(One person, without Alcohol), but if u prefer eating in a 3 or 5 star hotel cost can go up to 5000-12000 just for one meal(the food tastes pretty much same though).
Enjoyment - well if you are talking about clubs and stuff one night entry fees in Delhi can cost from 2000-3000
Traveling- that might cost you a bit more than you want to spend, if you are going places like Ladakh or Goa, it might cost you 50000 for around a week(Assuming you would like to stay in normal place, not at some excellent hotel).
Maid..- full-time 8000-10000 || maybe more, not sure abt it
shared 1500-2500
Driver (without the car)- 7000-10000.
With car - much more than you would wanna spend
Car- A nice brand new car can be purchased for 3-5 lakhs(insurance covered).

If you need help for anything else feel free to contact me.
#12 Sep 5th, 2010, 17:58
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  • Marco Solo is offline
#12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bellestie View Post Hi dillichaat

Thank you for an excellent reply.

Half my salary will be paid in the UK and half paid in India which like I said is in the region of 110,000 rupees after tax - which is what I was hoping to live off - and save my UK salary. Well at least, that is the goal!

The reason why I brought up the figure of 25,000 for rent is that on megabricks and 99acres, there seems to be a lot of 'nice sounding' properties for that rate in some decent sounding colonies - but again nor backed up with pictures or anything. All I am looking for is a 2 or 3 bed apartment in a secure area hopefully in a community where there is a club,pool,gym. I saw several properties advertised in places such as Heritage, Essel, Princetown, Nirvana (in Gurgaon) and some others for 25,000ish - do you think that those are scam adverts?

Yep, I have seen Delhi is far more expensive, think that may be why I may choose Gurgaon and travel to Delhi on weekends.



Luckily health insurance and medical expenses are all covered.

I have of course been given advice by colleagues who work out there but have so far found the information on here much more useful and realistic - thanks again.
Hi,
I understand that salary paid overseas is also fully taxable in India, being classified as "Resident but not Ordinarily Resident"
#13 Sep 5th, 2010, 19:55
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  • curtdfw is offline
#13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco Solo View Post Hi,
I understand that salary paid overseas is also fully taxable in India, being classified as "Resident but not Ordinarily Resident"
Yes, subject to some details. [Disclaimer - I'm no tax expert by any stretch.]

I think that, among other requirements, if you're in India for more than 183 days during the tax year beginning 1 April, there's a tax obligation. However, India has tax treaties with many countries that eliminate double taxation. It certainly made my US taxes more complicated, but then part of my expat deal was that the company's accountants did my tax preparation.
#14 Sep 5th, 2010, 20:07
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  • curtdfw is offline
#14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bellestie View Post The reason why I brought up the figure of 25,000 for rent is that on megabricks and 99acres, there seems to be a lot of 'nice sounding' properties for that rate in some decent sounding colonies - but again nor backed up with pictures or anything. All I am looking for is a 2 or 3 bed apartment in a secure area hopefully in a community where there is a club,pool,gym. I saw several properties advertised in places such as Heritage, Essel, Princetown, Nirvana (in Gurgaon) and some others for 25,000ish - do you think that those are scam adverts?
The club, pool and gym in any of these places is likely very basic and not at all what you're used to. I lived in Heritage City for ~three years, and the pool was never filled. I belonged to City Club in Gurgaon, but had reservations about the cleanliness of the pool -- too many times the water appeared off. Sanitation standards and practices in India are not always quite up to US or Euro standards. That said, you could probably find a 2BR place in Heritage City for 25k -- see post #2 here for more info about Heritage City.
Last edited by curtdfw; Sep 5th, 2010 at 21:58.. Reason: spelin'
#15 Sep 5th, 2010, 21:56
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#15
All

Thank you for some great feedback, suggestions and information. It has been most useful!

Quote:
I think that, among other requirements, if you're in India for more than 183 days during the tax year beginning 1 April, there's a tax obligation. However, India has tax treaties with many countries that eliminate double taxation. It certainly made my US taxes more complicated, but then part of my expat deal was that the company's accountants did my tax preparation.
It is the same with me, my companies accountants are taking care of all tax preparation etc.

Quote:
The club, pool and gym in any of these places is likely very basic and not at all what you're used to. I lived in Heritage City for ~three years, and the pool was never filled. I beloged to City Club in Gurgaon, but had reservations about the cleanliness of the pool -- too many times the water appeared off. Sanitation standards and practices in India are not always quite up to US or Euro standards. That said, you could probably find a 2BR place in Heritage City for 25k -- see post #2 here for more info about Heritage City.
Thanks for the info and your thread on HC was great. Do you know of any other communities that you can recommend. Another option would be to rent in Faridabad and commute - should only be about half an hour, probably would be cheaper, any takes on this?

I know my company is putting me up for the first few months but the more I know now, the better. Will be arriving late October! Whilst I have been a few times for short stretches, it has really set in now - slightly apprehensive!

Thanks all for the advice and information - :agentsmith: - thanks for registering to help out!

I think with the pricing, it is starting to look realistic now - although I could use my UK salary, I really want to save that part - so a middle class lifestyle for me for a while! I suppose it can all get worked out when I arrive and if I have to use some of my UK salary then so be it.


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