PIO - How to apply for Indian great-grandparents' birth certificates

Hello,

What tips do you have for applying for copies of great-grandparents' Indian birth certificates?

Have read elsewhere on the forum that late 1890s to early 1900s there was little to no record of births in India - which alternative records do you recommend we search for in order to prove our ancestors' were born in India?

Hope somebody out there can help.

Looking forward to your replies,
SS and Mr. SS

Which country are you currently a citizen of? If you were born outside India then you need to prove your parents or grandparents india origin through their landing documents etc...

In our case, we were landed immigrants but as children and no longer had our parents documents who are now passed away. Indian Embassy accepted a notarized letter taking oath that our parents are Indian - basically attesting to the fact that what we are saying is correct.

(maybe old family photos might work)

It was a BIG hassle but finally we got our PIO!!

Good Luck!!

Hi Arora

Thanks for your reply.

We are South African - our parents and grandparents were born in SA, but great-grandparents were born in India.

We have official South African documents stating that great-grandparents were Indian, but have difficulty finding documents from India (e.g. school certificate, passport etc.)

Did you get your affidavit from an authority in your home country or an Indian authority?

We got our PIO in Canada. Its good to hear that you have SA documents - Indian Embassy should be able to use them.

We did not have our parents indian documents either but used the Canadian landing documents showing their origin and place of birth was India. Getting documents from India would be impossible I think.

We took our documents to a Notary Public and had them notarized both the documents and our oath. I had my original documents but in my spouses case he only had photocopies of his parents documents. So, he had to speak to the Counsular Services Manager and he took his special request/ exemption to the Consulate of India and after few days we heard that it was approved considering the special circumstances of our parents having passed away.

I hope this helps. You just have to be pushy with them a bit and keep going back day after day if you have to. But, hey once you get it you are good for 15 years so you can relax after.

Once again, Good Luck!

Arora,

Thanks for sharing your experience. We'll investigate getting a signed affidavit but the way I understand it, is that Consulates and Embassies are not consistent in the way they treat PIO applications... what may work for one person may not for the next applicant.

We'll certainly give it a shot and also try to submit as much supporting documentation as possible.

Hi SaffaSusie, would love to hear if you got anywhere since June. I had a similar experience today. Three Indian consulates in three different cities in South Africa and three different stories. Johannesburg was the worst and did not even know what was happening and even referred me to a website where the page on PIO information was missing.

I have the copy of the ship landing papers of my great grandparents (from both sides) and great-great grandparents (one side). Of course there is paperwork in between, except for my grandmother's which I may having tracked down at a fee. The response from two consulates - you do not qualify for a PIO card.

I have heard of many South African Indians who threw in the towel, cancelled purchasing property and so on because they had a similar experience with the PIO issue. I plan to see it through, either directly with the consulate(s), through a third party broker or any other avenue. Any feedback on your side would be appreciated.

I was denied PIO status because I am 4th generation. My Grandfather was born in Trinidad but my Greatgrandfather came from India.

Not true - According to Bureau of Immigrations

Politely ask again, get an appointment with the first consul.

Print out the PIO requirement from Bureau of Immigrations, or MHA's website.

Hi Nomad,

To fill you in, we've moved to India (Bangalore to be precise) on my Employment visa but Mr. SS is heading back to SA in October to process the PIO application. We weren't able to do it earlier since we had to wait for Home Affairs to produce unabridged birth certificates for all the SA ancestors, thus reflecting their parentage.

We managed to find great-granddad's landing papers (although it's a copy of a copy, the "original" certified copy was lost). I really hope it's not as bad as you say, since Cape Town was a hopeless cause and they referred us to JHB. I would assume DBN to be the best consulate to apply through since they have a largest number of PIOs and based on that, the largest number of applications.

I struggle to understand JHB's motivation to deny your application, it seems sound? Needless to say, Indian consulates are "consistently inconsistent", to quote another India-Miker. Are you reapplying?

I was advised not to do it while in India since the attitude and work ethic is worse than what we experience at the consulates back home... the horror!

Let us know how you go... I will update the forum once we've word.

All the best,
SS

An update:
Mr SS submitted his application to JHB in October and received the PIO today which means he can return to India(just in time to renew his X visa FRRO!).

In addition to the standard PIO application form, he also included a cover letter mapping out the family lineage, his contact details and his current Indian visa situation (i.e. on an X visa). The supporting historical documentation was attested, and in the case of the photocopied original (see above for explanation ), they accepted it with an affidavit stating the original copy with stamp was lost.

Point to note is that all the SA consulates are completely clueless. It was only until he got hold of the Vice-Consul's number that Mr. SS lawyered the heck out of them and had the Vice Consul conduct the PIO interview over the phone last week.

So, points to note for South Africans intending to apply for PIO:
- Get all the documentation regarding ancestry copied and validated, get them certified as authentic copies
- Include a cover letter since the application form doesn't even have fields for one's contact details
- Allow for approx. 3 months from date of application
- Follow up relentlessly
- Try and get past the gatekeepers like reception, case workers etc. since they are completely clueless
- At the 8 week point, do try and get hold of the VC if you haven't received any notification on the status of the application
- Make it clear that it will be escalated to the Consul-General if there's no final response

We've proof it's not impossible to get things done via the Indian Consulates in SA, jy het net hare op jou tande nodig (you just need hair on your teeth).

Good luck!

Hi SS

I did my application in January 2012 in Durban. Still waiting. No news. Nobody interested in giving an answer. Not yet 3 months. So will keep you posted on this thread.

Thanks SS. Hope all is well in Bangalore. Everything of the best.

Still no reply. No feedback. No assistance. Anybody else had some success? If only South Africa had a middle man like Travista in the United States who deals with PIO applications rather than the consulate.

NomadOutThere, have you tried the South African Indian Archives in Pietermaritzburg. They help trace your ancestral information and assist with filling the PIO forms etc. They are the closest to TRAVISA that we have in South Africa I would think.