Kolkata-Mandu ??

deepmajumder

hi travel buddies,
i contemplated visiting mandu some time back but could not make out what route should i pursue. what i learnt was that i should go to indore first. but there is only one train (shipra exp) between kolkata-indore and that too runs only thrice a week. now that i have become a member of IM i thought of asking the gurus here, what is the shortest route. and what other places can i visit near by - omkareshwar ? maheshwar ? ujjain ?

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jyotirmoy

There is one train that runs on Mondays to Bhopal.
3025 HWH BPL EXPRESS

Jorge Reverter

Probably a good way is via Bhopal and Indore. In Bhopal you can visit Sanchiand the caves in Udaygiri near Vidisha. Is always complicated to reach Mandu. Last month have stayed in Mandu three days and my way was by train via Bhopal and Indore and from Indore to Dhar by bus (it takes one hour and you have buses every few minutes) and from Dhar bus to Mandu (1hour 40 min. and bus every half and hour).

Another way is by train to Khandwa and from there by bus to Barwaha/Sanawad, then another bus to Maheshwar and again by bus to Mandu. A long and complicated way but the visit to Mandu worth always this hard journey through sites like Omkareshwar and Maheshwar.

Jorge

deepmajumder

thanks Jorge for all the info. can this journey via bhopal and then to mandu and other places be completed in around 7-8 days? its always difficult to take leave for more than a week

machadinha

I guess going by Bhopal & Indore would make the most sense; check if there's a route taking you over Itarsi. This might or might not in fact see you coming in by way of Khandwa & Maheshwar, as described by Jorge (in that case, I'd probably go Omkareshwar-Maheshwar-Mandu or something. Take your time in Mandu, I spent a week there, it's quite relaxed, and its sights are magnificent, you'd need at least two days to see them all I'd say. What's more, it's nice to hang out there not sightseeing so much, but having these great buildings & ruins, as well as the surrounding ravines -- Mandu as you may know is set on a plateau --, just simply be the backdrop to your stay.)

I found travel in that region last year (by public bus; note that to my best knowledge there exist no deluxe buses here. MP Tourism is said to have once run them, but to have abandoned the service some years ago) painfully slow (as well as extremely uncomfortable, think packed to the brim & beyond, now make that 42 degrees Celsius -- and probably even higher in real summer -- to add to the fun); others seem to report more favorably on it. Roads are just terrible, and 20 kms./hr. here for those buses at least would be a good speed. If you can afford to, consider hiring (locally) a taxi or car & driver, which would presumably speed up your travel considerably, as well as be way more comfortable, of course. I did so a couple of times this year on similar roads further north-east in Madhya Pradesh, and those cars will more easily hit 60-90 kms/hr. As well as have the better suspension & the rather more comfy seats, needless to say A world of difference, I'll tell you. (In fact I suspect those who report more favorably on travel as such here both in terms of speed & comfort did in fact do it by car.)

(There are said to be a few main roads crossing the region which are more comfortable btw. Suffice it to say I never traveled on those, and presumably neither or at least rarely will you if you need to locally get from A to B via X, i.e., are not just traversing it as quickly and comfortably as you can to get to the next major city or state.)

Near to Bhopal are the prehistoric caves with rock paintings of Bhimbetka btw. Haven't visited, supposed to be magnificent, as well as to offer great natural scenery. Hoshangabad has also been recommended to me as a decidedly under-visited place (or by Westerners at least), nonetheless with ghats and temples and stuff; again, I've not been.

I believe btw one of the more significant temple complexes along the Narmada, and in this same region I think, yet funnily mentioned in no guidebooks I know of (it's probably mostly significant to Hindu pilgrims), is that of Mahadeo. You might want to check what you can find out about it.

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machadinha

Off the top of my head btw, I think there are trains as well from Khandwa to Omkareshwar (as there are from Itarsi to Khandwa). O'war's railway station would then be a little out of town, nothing a rickshaw ride won't resolve I believe.

You could then proceed from O'war to Maheshwar by bus, then ditto M'war-Mandu. Maybe proceed, by bus again, to Dhar, then return home via Bhopal. By public bus again, count on a few hours for each of these stretches (and probably far more to get to Bhopal, although hitting a highway there, perhaps from Indore, should speed things up), again, travel here is slow. E.g. Dhar-Mandu is just 40 kms. or so I think, yet as Jorge says it takes another 1.5 hours or so. And, if memory serves, yet another change of buses midway, which is the case here more often than not. Thing is if you get on timely at the starting point, you'll be able to secure a seat & leave the others standing; but with those stop-overs and getting on to the next bus midway on a route, you'll be doing the standing, of course.

Dhar I quite liked; there isn't much to do, but it sees very few tourists (or again of the Western variety in any case), and it has a good Islamic fort. Lesser known is its (remains of a, pretty well-preserved though, and there are active Muslim places of worship as well as of burial nearby it if I recall -- as well as local tensions between various religions, or so I was sadly told, notably Hindus, Muslims and Christians I believe. Expect some security checks here, and then coupled with that there appears to be local dacoitry, or banditry, not that this should give you as a visitor much concern, but you'll notice road checkpoints and stuff in the wider area. The entire area is heavily tribal, too; in Mandu I was told they comprise some 90% if not more of the population, not that this would be readily visible to a stranger) old madrasa, just make local enquiries to find it, and there's an attractive (active, and presumably more modern) Hindu temple on a hillock just on the outskirts of town. Could well merit a night or two's stay I'd say.

Bhopal many say is just another overblown city, however it's supposed to have (quite) some interesting Muslim (as well as Hindu) heritage, as well as some active bar life and stuff, I suspect I might like it.

Indore on the other hand would be much closer to Dhar of course, however except for being a logical regional connection point, I've never heard of it holding much of any interest, or indeed of it being an attractive place to visit at all for that matter.

Jorge Reverter

Is almost impossible to reach Omkareshwar by train from Khandwa, it was my initial itinerary and finally have moved to Indore, Dhar, etc.

If you need to stay in Indore I reccommend a very good hotel at quite reasonable prices not far from the railways station:
Hotel Kanchan
Kanchan Baug
phone: 2518501-5
email: hotelkanchan@yahoo.co.in

They don't reply the emails, so better make a call.

Prices: single rooms:700-800-900
double rooms:1050-1200-1300

Jorge

machadinha

Acha Jorge (btw: We should have done this route together last year, nah? ); Khandwa-O'war by bus is feasible though. Comfortable it again is not the way I recall, but, well. What can you do. (Edit: Or, come to think of it, I do seem to recall noticing the bus finally picking up some speed going south from O'war and so towards Khandwa actually. It does I think involve another change of buses or two like you described, Jorge.)

In Dhar, I stayed in the Royal Residency, just by the bus stand. Their cheaper non-A/C rooms face it and so are noisy; they're large and comfortable though & the (Bengali, if he's still there. I think he was Kolkatan in fact ) manager can't do enough to please you. While their bar & restaurant last spring at least had closed down, it still did room service, and serving not at all bad food. At that time, the room (double to myself) cost me Rs. 350. Note I found this year room rates seem to have about doubled pretty much all around the country however, or at least where I was, so including northern MP.

Opt for the (naturally costlier) AC rooms at the back to (presumably) avoid the noise.

machadinha

nb

So assuming that includes getting to & from there from Kolkata, I'd count on two (and potentially fairly grueling) days or so to get to where you want to be in the region, as well as back (except if you fly into e.g. Bhopal or Indore, of course. Being lesser airports, flying there won't be the cheapest though. And then while perhaps seemingly short, what with getting to and from the airport and stuff, even a flight will take you the better part of a day.)

Nah, I'd try and save up some time to make it a longer trip when you can. Others are less conservative with such estimates though, and then no few Indians arguably have a way of zipping around the place that few of us foreigners would be able to emulate.

Let's put it like this, just going Bharuch-Dhar-Mandu-Maheshwar-Omkareshwar-and then getting out of there by way of Itarsi to head down south (and all of it by cheap and public transport) took me three weeks or so, if not four. Then again it was hot (so no point in, nor even a chance of, rushing around), I didn't feel like hurrying anyway (spent 4-7 days in most places), and it was part of a two-month trip (less reason to rush again, and then I'm not 24 anymore either). Others are arguably quicker

(Bharuch-Dhar -- I'd meant to go straight to Mandu -- by bus, and with again three or four changes of buses as it turned out, may not seem that far on a map and as the crow flies btw and for instance, but it nonetheless took me some 12 hours and via various criss-cross ways. Now while I may normally -- and preferably on a direct connection, mind -- find that manageable in an Indian context & I've had -- far -- longer even, on those particular buses and those particular roads, after twelve hours I just didn't know how to sit anymore, and you get to a point where all you want is out.

Etc. Oh, little to no English spoken all along the way, of course, though you might get by provided you speak some Hindi.)

Jorge Reverter

Roads from Indore to Dhar and Mandu were not bad. I can even say they were narrow but good and the buses were running quite fast.

Jorge

machadinha

Hm, yes. I hear Indore-Dhar should be not bad, and I'm guessing not all that long; then those extra 1.5 hours to cover, again, just 40 kms. or what is it probably wouldn't hurt much.

They do as the final leg of an already painful journey as described, believe me. (As does arriving in Mandu with little money only to find that despite the ample tourism there's no ATM nor even a bank there, and so a 3-hour ride back and forth to Dhar where you just came from is what you're facing. There's a bank midway along the way in Nalcha I believe btw -- but still no ATM, I think. This is where that traveler's cheque or cash you were carrying comes in handy, there are private handlers to take them, at not the best of rates, of course.)

JuliaF

machadinha, are you thinking of Mahadeo hill (with Shiva temple on top) just outside Pachmarhi? It's in that region (Hoshangabad district in fact) but not really 'along the Narmada' as such.

Or maybe there is another Mahadeo on the river bank somewhere
(or maybe there was and it's now submerged in a dam. A little while ago an Indian member here wanted to visit some temple or other near Omkar and came back to say it's not there any more.)

Either way I'd like to find out more about it.

deepmajumder

wow! some great info.. thank you guys - machadinha and jorge.

machadinha

I think (but can't be sure) Mahadeo is just one of Shiva's titles; I likewise think but can't be sure Mahadeo is just an alternative spelling (or transliteration rather) of Mahadev(a) = simply "(The) Great God." So either way you'll find many Mahadeo temples all over India.

I similarly think but can't be sure the one I've heard of should be possibly not on the Narmada, but near it; and further west along it actually from the Dhar district and Omkareshwar and thereabouts that we're thinking of.

But, I may well be talking out of my behind, it's been known to happen Gita Mehta in her A River Sutra, set along the river, mentions it several times. It should be on a map I have really, which is in the mail however, it's due to arrive today, if I think of it I'll look it up. (The excellent Nelles Maps, see if you can get a hold of it in India, it features tourist pointers, so forts and temples and parks and whatnot, and a lot of stuff you won't find in any guidebooks. Their Central or Western India or whatever map would be what you need for this region, they have four or five I think for all of India.)

Hm, yes, you may have heard of the infamous Sardar Sarovar Dam (or simply: Narmada Dam) project(s), causing a decade or so of protests, if not two by now. There are other such dam projects along the river (and, of course, along others) underway as we speak; one was just halted & sent back to the drawing table a month or so ago as I was there, as it turned out none of the prognoses and analyses vis-à-vis gains and (socio-) environmental effects etc. (or even its construction, if I recall right) had been properly done, and it was ruled it should never have been approved under these conditions in the first place.

nb Deep, while lengthy and with a lot of asides as you might expect, this thread covers my trip last year in the region where you're going; amidst the chatter, you'll find plenty of helpful tips by fellow members there (Julia and Jorge included ) of places to go, and in the much wider (MP) region too. Good luck with it: Mach rides again: Slowly along the Narmada, Kerala, Coorg, loop north instead...

Jorge Reverter

I've seen the possible trains from Kolkata to Bhopal/Indore and you need almost 48 hours to reach Mandu. I have a great opinion about Mandu but really I think 48 hours is too much. Try to do it in a longer journey visiting other sites in the way to Mandu, may be Varanasi, Chitrakoot, Chanderi, Sanchi... should a good itinerary. Otherwise try to get a flight to Indore or Bhopal.

Jorge


Edit: Probably 48 hours is a bit excessive, but the only direct train from Kolkata to Indore reaches Indore 03.30 am (if there are no delays) after 33.45 hours. So, if you take a bus to Dhar at let's say 07.00 you'll be in Mandu around midday.