reclaim Indian citizenship

akd_2009 · Apr 14th, 2009, 08:55

My daughter born in India and staying after 10 years in USA recently accepted US citizenship. But due to her personal reason she wanted to go back to India to live there permanently. She will be visiting India with Indian visa and wanted to surrender her US citizenship in any US consulate and that time she may be treated as illegal immigrant. What is the legal procedure to reclaim the Indian citizenship with immediate effect.
Any legal advice will be highly appreciated.

mazha · Apr 14th, 2009, 12:22

There is no such quick procedure, Indian citizenship is not easy to get back.

The easiest route to get Indian citizenship takes 5 years. For that, she will have to get an OCI card, and after living 1 year abroad and 4 years in India with it, she can get her Indian citizenship back.

The other route is the regular route for all foreigners. Stay in India for 12 years without breaks, and then apply.

edwardseco · Apr 14th, 2009, 13:48

I wonder if she could try the lost passport routine and while living in India request a duplicate..

Haylo · Apr 14th, 2009, 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by akd_2009

My daughter born in India and staying after 10 years in USA recently accepted US citizenship. But due to her personal reason she wanted to go back to India to live there permanently.

Citizenship is not, as your daughter has already found to her cost, something to be given up lightly and I would strongly advise against giving up her American citizenship at this point. "Personal reasons" which seem compelling right now may seem far less so after ten years of living in India.

She can apply straight away at the nearest Indian Embassy for "OCI" status, which stands for "Overseas Citizen of India" - with this, she can travel to India without a visa and live there visa-free for the rest of her life. Processing time varies, your Embassy may give information on their usual turnaround times.

Quote:

Any legal advice will be highly appreciated.

Sorry, this is a travel forum, if you want legal advice you'll have to pay for it. Yes, some members are in the legal profession, but all that members offer on this forum are their opinions!

edwardseco · Apr 14th, 2009, 21:24

The trick really is to not give up the Indian passport in the process of naturalization. Some claim it was lost..

Haylo · Apr 14th, 2009, 22:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by edwardseco

The trick really is to not give up the Indian passport in the process of naturalization. Some claim it was lost..

I have heard of people doing that, and it seems as if some do get away with it.

However, in case the OP doesn't realise, we should point out that it is of course illegal to hold an Indian passport if you are not an Indian citizen, and the act of acquiring citizenship of another country does immediately rescind your Indian citizenship.

The OP's daughter would therefore have the status of an illegal immigrant in India, and if her situation was ever brought to the attention of the Indian authorities, she would be deported and would be highly unlikely to ever be granted a visa to return to India.

Nick-H · Apr 15th, 2009, 00:39

Well, yes, but... I think many Indians manage to keep hold of their old passports, and use them even as proof of entitlement to PIO and OCI. I met a guy in London at the High Commission, who was doing this, and told me that many do.

They don't get arrested on the spot, or told never to go near the High Commission ever, ever, ever again.

Haylo · Apr 15th, 2009, 01:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick-H

Well, yes, but... I think many Indians manage to keep hold of their old passports, and use them even as proof of entitlement to PIO and OCI. I met a guy in London at the High Commission, who was doing this, and told me that many do.

They don't get arrested on the spot, or told never to go near the High Commission ever, ever, ever again.

Keeping your old passport and living illegally in India on that old passport would be a very different matters. What worried me was that the OP' was asking "how do I regain instant Indian citizenship after surrendering a US passport" and people were suggesting using an old India passport - perhaps records aren't kept but frankly, pretending you never had US citizenship and just going back to using your old Indian passport is a ploy that seems fraught with pitfalls to me.

chAos · Apr 15th, 2009, 01:15

I think living in India illegally is not even a realistic option. Sheesh. Besides trouble with the law, the OP could get sick and the daughter couldn't visit? Nah, not worth it, so forget all that.

As Haylo says, the way to go is to get the lifetime visa otherwise known as OCI. Once in hand, the daughter can live in India, work in India, do almost everything a citizen of India can do (i.e. no voting), and find that's enough for her purposes. If not, and a full citizenship is desired, then living in India for some years as Mazha mentions, is the next legal step.

There's no need to surrender your old passport btw; they mark in invalid with a stamp or punched hole, and then it continues to be yours to keep.

Nick-H · Apr 15th, 2009, 01:39

Oh yes, Haylo... totally agree.

It is crazy to try to become a stateless person.

Pretending the US citizenship didn't happen would be a bit like pretending one never got married: not a substitute for divorce!

RWeHavingFunYet · Apr 15th, 2009, 02:47

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OP had mentioned that her daughter will be visiting India on a indian visa. If this visa was already obtained, the indian authorities already know that she is a US citizen. Looks like the best option for 'instant citizenship' is 5 years after getting a OCI card (from this website).

USA Green cards can be surendered to obtain a tourist visa. To surrender US citizenship, one need to first obtain indian citizenship and take a oath to surrender US or any other citizenships.

Dilliwala · Apr 15th, 2009, 06:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by mazha

There is no such quick procedure, Indian citizenship is not easy to get back.

The easiest route to get Indian citizenship takes 5 years. For that, she will have to get an OCI card, and after living 1 year abroad and 4 years in India with it, she can get her Indian citizenship back.

The other route is the regular route for all foreigners. Stay in India for 12 years without breaks, and then apply.

Having just thoroughly researched this - almost none of the above is correct.

To start with, the 12-year law is relevant only in cases of acquiring citizenship by naturalisation, i.e for those with no prior 'links' to India of any kind.
But the OP's daughter does, so under Sec.5 of the Citizenship Act, 1955 - 'Citizenship by registration' - she can regain Indian citizenship after one year of living in India - or earlier even! (I'm presuming she is 18+)
First the iffy interpretation - subsection 1(b):
"a person of Indian origin who is ordinarily resident in any country or place outside undivided India" (note: no minimum stay mentioned, so basically the processing time - cud be 6 months, or 6 years!)

This one's much more solid - subsection 1(f):
"a person of full age and capacity who, or either of his parents, was earlier citizen of independent India, and has been residing in India for one year immediately before making an application for registration"
And in special circumstances, the GOI can waive the minimum stay requirement.

http://www.mha.gov.in/pdfs/ic_act55.pdf

Renunciation of current citizenship -
Since an application for Indian citizenship can be turned down, the Q of renunciation of current citizenship does not arise until the Indian citizenship is granted - no one expects such an applicant to live stateless. Subject to an undertaking having to be given alongwith the application that the person will renounce his/her current citizenship if Indian citizenship is granted. Refer Part III of Indian Citizenship Rules, 1956.

http://www.mha.gov.in/pdfs/ic_rule56.pdf

akd - your daughter cud check with the nearest Indian consulate under which conditions 5.1 (b) if the Act is applicable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haylo

"Personal reasons" which seem compelling right now may seem far less so after ten years of living in India.

Or far more so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chAos

As Haylo says, the way to go is to get the lifetime visa otherwise known as OCI. Once in hand, the daughter can live in India, work in India, do almost everything a citizen of India can do (no voting), and find that's enough for her purposes. If not, and a full citizenship is desired, then living in India for some years as Mazha mentions, is the next legal step.

Can't hold a govt job.
Can't become Head of State.
Can't become Vice President.
Can't become a High Court or Supreme Court judge.
Can't stand for election to any Legislature in the land (therefore can't become a minister, Chief Minister, or Prime Minister either).

edwardseco · Apr 15th, 2009, 07:03

Quote:

would be a bit like pretending one never got married: not a substitute for divorce!

In India, I know of a couple of cases..

mazha · Apr 15th, 2009, 07:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dilliwala

Having just thoroughly researched this - almost none of the above is correct.

Thanks for that, good to know that you can get it back in 1 year. I guess I got the numbers flipped for OCI, it is 5 years after getting OCI, out of which at least one year should be in India.

chAos · Apr 15th, 2009, 08:20

Oh, didn't mean to imply voting was the only difference. The "for example" that was in my mind didn't find its way to my fingertips. So thanks for elucidating, DW.

I think OCI's also cannot own agricultural land.

However, for travel purposes, isn't it easier to travel on a US passport, as more countries require visas from Indian citizens than US ones?

Apr 14th, 2009, 08:55	#1
akd_2009 Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: usa Posts: 2	reclaim Indian citizenship My daughter born in India and staying after 10 years in USA recently accepted US citizenship. But due to her personal reason she wanted to go back to India to live there permanently. She will be visiting India with Indian visa and wanted to surrender her US citizenship in any US consulate and that time she may be treated as illegal immigrant. What is the legal procedure to reclaim the Indian citizenship with immediate effect. Any legal advice will be highly appreciated.

Apr 15th, 2009, 01:15	#9
chAos I have a theory... Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: dakshin Posts: 1,334	I think living in India illegally is not even a realistic option. Sheesh. Besides trouble with the law, the OP could get sick and the daughter couldn't visit? Nah, not worth it, so forget all that. As Haylo says, the way to go is to get the lifetime visa otherwise known as OCI. Once in hand, the daughter can live in India, work in India, do almost everything a citizen of India can do (i.e. no voting), and find that's enough for her purposes. If not, and a full citizenship is desired, then living in India for some years as Mazha mentions, is the next legal step. There's no need to surrender your old passport btw; they mark in invalid with a stamp or punched hole, and then it continues to be yours to keep. Last edited by chAos : Apr 15th, 2009 at 08:23. Reason: 2 little letters

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Apr 14th, 2009, 12:22	#2
mazha Back to Lurking Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Somewhere Posts: 501	There is no such quick procedure, Indian citizenship is not easy to get back. The easiest route to get Indian citizenship takes 5 years. For that, she will have to get an OCI card, and after living 1 year abroad and 4 years in India with it, she can get her Indian citizenship back. The other route is the regular route for all foreigners. Stay in India for 12 years without breaks, and then apply.

Apr 14th, 2009, 13:48	#3
edwardseco Maha Guru Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Land that shakes and bakes. Posts: 5,841	I wonder if she could try the lost passport routine and while living in India request a duplicate..

Apr 14th, 2009, 21:24	#5
edwardseco Maha Guru Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Land that shakes and bakes. Posts: 5,841	The trick really is to not give up the Indian passport in the process of naturalization. Some claim it was lost..

Apr 15th, 2009, 00:39	#7
Nick-H This is just a cameo appearance Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Chennai, India Posts: 36,197	Well, yes, but... I think many Indians manage to keep hold of their old passports, and use them even as proof of entitlement to PIO and OCI. I met a guy in London at the High Commission, who was doing this, and told me that many do. They don't get arrested on the spot, or told never to go near the High Commission ever, ever, ever again.

Apr 15th, 2009, 01:39	#10
Nick-H This is just a cameo appearance Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Chennai, India Posts: 36,197	Oh yes, Haylo... totally agree. It is crazy to try to become a stateless person. Pretending the US citizenship didn't happen would be a bit like pretending one never got married: not a substitute for divorce!

Apr 15th, 2009, 02:47	#11
RWeHavingFunYet .. . . . N . o . r . i . k . o . . . .. Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: 17°25'N, 78°31'E Posts: 233	. . . . OP had mentioned that her daughter will be visiting India on a indian visa. If this visa was already obtained, the indian authorities already know that she is a US citizen. Looks like the best option for 'instant citizenship' is 5 years after getting a OCI card (from this website). USA Green cards can be surendered to obtain a tourist visa. To surrender US citizenship, one need to first obtain indian citizenship and take a oath to surrender US or any other citizenships.

Apr 15th, 2009, 08:20	#15
chAos I have a theory... Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: dakshin Posts: 1,334	Oh, didn't mean to imply voting was the only difference. The "for example" that was in my mind didn't find its way to my fingertips. So thanks for elucidating, DW. I think OCI's also cannot own agricultural land. However, for travel purposes, isn't it easier to travel on a US passport, as more countries require visas from Indian citizens than US ones?