NON-religious itineraries -avoiding temples, temples, mosques, Gurdwaras, Churches

skk

I am vehemently anti-religion, equal opportunity anti-religion at that, but diplomatic about it ( why, when the hospital chaplain visited me 3 hours after a major operation recently I had the wherewithal to be polite, and gently ease him out of the room, instead of screaming at him - GET THE F*CK OUTTAHERE, on the principle of - if you can't enforce then stfu, perforce ).

It does make Indian first class citizen orientated tours unavailable to me - their focus often is to this or that temple or holy place with belief in their holiness a central ingredient.

During my 2 months in India, I'm planning a leisurely, 5 day trip down the Western Coast - using the Konkan railway probably as far as Mangalore, Cochi or further;

How do I avoid the temple crowd and temple orientated 1 day tours in the various cities along the way especially in Kerala ?

Any general tips for improving the lot of us atheists in India amidst our travels would also be appreciated.

-K

Brisso

ermm ... don't take the tours - most don't. I spent 6 weeks at the start of the year and didn't visit one (if you exclude Amma's which is more of a new age pop-religion factory). Work out your own itinerary.

machadinha

Have to agree with Brisso. In several months there, I never encountered any overly religious stuff unless I looked for it (I don't mind visiting the occasional temple or mosque or church myself -- and btw I never found any of them very restrictive in India, although one hears this may depend on region and so on).

But you can easily get around there without any of it I'd say.

Organized tours, well, they'll follow the popular itineraries of course, with all the highlights (temples and blah) that entails.

Suggest just strolling around by yourself indeed. I never took any tour there. Just mostly went where I wanted. Takes some time and flexibility I guess.

It struck me again going by some recent threads how from the news we may think India is highly divided along religious lines. The opposite is true: People have been generally getting along with all sorts of denominations for hundreds if not thousands of years. Don't worry too much about it.

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capt_mahajan

Certain spots have temples and such as the main (and only) attraction. I avoid going there. Its easy.

That said, some non practicing old temples, eg Rajasthan, are worth a visit. IIRC, the ruins of Hampi have some temples too, (not absolutely sure) and so are they.

It is easy to avoid temples or religious spots/pilgrimages, even for Hindus. One simply does not have to go there, or (eg places like RIshikesh, well worth a visit in their own right) just don't stay there too long.

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wonderwomanusa

And even if you do take the canned tours offered by the local tourism development folks, you don't have to go IN the temples -- and in fact may not be allowed to go in.

Just find a spot in the shade to sit down and watch people each do their own thing; some will come over to talk with you and the time will pass.

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skk

Wow, those were fast responses - Thanks... I'm cogitating on those.

My question is - how much more different religosity-wise is South India ? I'm pretty familiar with Maharastra.

Let me give some context - I'm jaundiced about this I guess from what I thought was a religion avoiding visit c199x to the Delhi/Agra area -I avoided the usual Krishna sites at Mathura and Gokul but went to Vrindavan - after all that's where he screwed around( I know my Krishanyan - read it when I was eight :-)) which seemed more valid behavior than praying..

Anyway I was shocked ! It was a total money milking operation - they even had this curtain and something called Krishna darshan with lots of sound and the poor innocent peasants agape and this curtain comes down and there is a murti of Krishna and the scam artists(priests + assistants ) triumphantly saying - There's Krishna ( huh? ) and rub your nose along the ground -

well I'm f*cked if I'm gonna do it - my taxi driver who was with me notices I'm not kowtowing - getting anxious;then the money requests start and again I'm f*cked if I'm gonna do more than 5 or 10 Rs - my taxi driver put more money down than me ! :-) frowns and aggressiveness all round and we make our excuses and leave - the taxi driver was quite ashen; I was a bit scared too.

That's just one experience at a major site - the new Bahai temple in Delhi ( refugees from the persecution in Iran ) was very different, very hmmmm very go with your own god, no money sh*t.

Nowadays I don't even go inside a temple so the problem doesn't arise but I don't know how it is in Southern India - I've seen the stuff on hmm what's that big temple in South India on teevee - I really want to avoid that and similar stuff, as diplomatically as I can.

Thanks for the advice.

-skk

machadinha

Hm. I'm only giving this a quick glance right now & don't have the time for it, but the occasional paragraph break and so on would make it much easier to read.

I'll try and look at it again later. But (and I'm not even being cynical) just because you're over-excited doesn't mean we have to be. Please try to present your questions in an understandable format.

capt_mahajan

In the south,too, religious places attract tourists by the droves.

There seem to be more 'temple towns' in a fair bit of the south, and one can avoid them, or not, very easily.

kristinm

Speaking as I am from the midst of a traffic lockdown and massive other inconveniences that come with living right in the heart of 'World Youth Day Pilgrimage Areas'... I can tell you my anti-religious fervour is currently at fever pitch!

However, while in India, while I didn't mind observing others in the practice of their often colourful and interesting worship, and grew to enjoy the call to prayer floating over the cities in the early mornings, We only went inside the places that were worth seeing apart from the religious elements -

Golden Temple, Taj, Friday Mosque in Delhi, Humayan's tomb, Qwaali performance at Nizamuddin tomb, a couple of ancient Hindu temples with amazing stonework and carvings etc etc oh and of course the Jain temples at Ranakpur... all the above were breathtaking for either their architecture, stonework, sheer beauty or one thing or another.. I was quite able to ignore the religiosity while appreciating the beauty of Islamic or ancient Sanskrit art and decoration....

Its cutting off your nose to spite your face a little to simply ignore such things in order to avoid religion isn't it?

skk

Fair point - I'm ok with dead/no-longer-used religious places, and I'll fade it to include lightly used places like say Worcester Cathedral or Bath Abbey.

I can even fade it further and did find beauty in the poetic, haunting call to prayer by the muezzin, amped up and all, as it floated across the bay on a moonlit night in Kalkan, Turkey. But he said his piece and then there was a majestic silence again across the bay - his voice and poignancy still reverberating in my brain.

Anything more active and intrusive than that is something I want to avoid.

-skk

shashank.aggarwal

I guess internally you are still a religious person, and that is why you are impacted by all these things...

If you were that nonreligious then all the activities of a religious place would have been just that for you..random activities ...you go there see what you are there to see and forget about the religious element...

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Travelogue - Around India

skk

This conversation was useful to me - I know what I'll look for in each of the cities.

The universities are probably pretty important - architecturally and more. Visiting those and hanging out amongst the students in their local tea-shops and more will be fun.

There are probably hubs of financial activity - the local wholesale markets and watching their "futures" and cash market trading for whatever the local product( cardemom?) will be interesting.

Kerala has played a role in the worldwide Communist 'religion' - I should be able to visit the party HQ and their party museum.

There may be space program adjuncts in the areas I'm in that are open to the public, like Nasa is at Houston and FL.

Cricket stadia will be fun, especially if they are empty when I visit.

There may be a music scene there - western fusion and more - I know of bands likes vinapra and Indian Ocean; that will be worth checking out.

I think I have quite some material to go with here.

-SKK

Cayle

But then you'll miss out on the priest with the peanut butter breath and no sense of personal space.

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