sangla-chitkul in dec 4th '09

pg66 · Oct 29th, 2009, 01:22

Thanks bdchatt
My tour plan was as follows
15 oct left kolkata by Rajdhani Exp
16 Oct reached New Delhi at 10 AM Did sightseeing in Delhi
17 Oct Delhi - Kalka by 7-40 AM Shatabdi Exp to reach KALKA at 11-40 AM Availed car to Shimla reached at 2-00 PM
18 Oct left Shimla at 10-30 AM to reach Sarahan at 3-30 PM (including about an hur halt for fuel , lunch , toilet etc )
19 Oct Left Sarahan at 10-30 AM to reach Sangla at 1-30 PM
20 Oct left Sangla at 10-00 AM to reach Chitkul at 11-00 AM came back to Sangla at 1-30 PM , LUNCH left for Kalpa at 2-00 PM to reach Kalpa at 4-00 pm
21 Oct Kalpa and Roghi villiage , 30 min from Kalpa
22 Oct left Kalpa at 9-30 AM to reach Narkanda at 3-30 PM
23 Oct left Narkanda at11-00 AM to reach Shimla at 1-00 PM brief stop , left Shimla at 3-00 pm to reach Kalka at 5-30

Accomodation
Shimla - Hotel White , nice view , clean , no kitchen and physially challenging to reach by foot . Very near mall is big plus . Rate 1350 /- plus 10% tax for room with private balconey

Sarahan - HPTDC SRIKHAND , stayed in Super DLX rooms 1500 /- plus tax , lower rates available . Better than cottage . This is best accommodation in Sarahan , though bit expensive .
Food very costly , try nearby chinese dhabas for ggod cheap food

Sangla - Prakash Guest House , Super DLX rooms @ 750 Try to get Room No 301 in second floor . Hotel is half km out of main town but has pristene surrounding . Good food , reasonable rate , nice view . But rooms are small and bit cold .

Kalpa - Kinnaur Kailash cottage @ 1700/- plus tax for 4 bedded suite . Very nice view , location , clean with room heater . Food very expensive .Kalpa has many hotels and a number of them are managed by bengalees , like Rakpa Regency , Golden Apple etc .

Vehicle : As per many good recommendations of IMERs I contacted Ramchand for vehicle . He provided Tavera . Rate 2300/- per day all inclusive , but he provided a small discount . Driver was Satpal , whom I specificallly mentioned .

My advice - 1)Speak and negotiate with Ramchand over phone but take email confirmation about rate , advance to be paid . However Ramchand is a nice young man , who tries to provide good service . Satpal is reliable and safe .

2)Whatever you save from vehicle hire charge , please give some allowances to the driver and insist that he stays in a room and not in car . Please remember , driver is the key person for your safe journey and not a good car or reliable travel agent . He needs to be in fresh body and mind next day to drive you safely in difficult terrain
3)Drink Mineral water

I will post my tour report with photos in a few days , however any querry is welcome
Thanks

bdchatt · Oct 30th, 2009, 00:58

Too good information for me and i must remember pg's advice.
My plan looks like :
4th Dec : Kalka mail from howrah
5th Dec : train
6th Dec : Early morning Kalka then Shimla by Shivalik Dlx exp.
7th Dec : Narkanda
8th Dec ; Kalpa
9th Dec : Kalpa
10th Dec: sangla
11th Dec: Sarahan
12th Dec: Shimla
13th Dec: Delhi by volvo
14th Dec: Duronto Exp. from Delhi
15th Dec: Kolkata

Now my confusion is ,
i. Is the plan Ok ?
ii. i've seen that people usually go through the route, you travelled. My plan is little bit different. Is there any problem to go first Kalpa from narkanda and lastly from sarahan to shimla ?

indracal · Oct 30th, 2009, 03:07

My two cents

-

Yes, the plan looks ok to me.

It's good that you aren't spending much time in Shimla, pretty crowded (though would be comparatively better during your travel time).

Try to catch the arati at the Sarahan Bhimakali temple on 11th evening/12th morning, if possible both.

Quote:

From Bhimakali Temple website:
Aarti Timings and offerings: In a day four aartis are done at regular intervals at the shrine.Flowers, Dhoop, Incense, Rice, Camphor, Clove, Cardamom, Kumkum, vermillion etc are used in pooja. The first aarti takes at dawn around 6.00 a.m. in summers and 7.30 a.m. in winters.
The second aarti is performed after two hours of the first.
The third aarti is at noon and the offerings are the local food to the mother goddess.
The fourth aarti is shyana arti, after offerings are made to the mother goddess salokas from the religious texts are recited.

Sarahan to Shimla should be around 6/6.5 hrs (105 KMs @ 30/35 KMPH in a car). The route is this (also includes important distances).

bdchatt · Oct 30th, 2009, 18:16

very nice indra...
i think i can attend last two aarti ,if i go from sangla to sarahan...

pg66 · Nov 1st, 2009, 23:21

My observation on bdchatts tour program
a) Height of Narkanda 2700 m and Kalpa 2900 m I think you will be gaining height too much too soon from plains . It is advisable to stay at lower height like Shimla 2100m or Fagu around same height .
b) In December , please check availability of accommodation at Kalpa and Sangla , even if accommodation available , whether water is avilable . Because of snow-fall at upper reaches piped water may not be easily available .
c)Although I satyed at Narkanda , I thnk Peach Blossom Fagu has beter view of snow-clad peaks than Narkanda
d) Since in December it willl be biting cold , it is better to gain height gradually and acclimatise with height and cold .My suggestion - Kalka - Shimla - Sarahan -Sangla /Kalpa -Kalpa/Sangla - Fagu - Kalka .
e)It was Ramchand's advise to stay for two nights at Sangla . I ignored it but afer visiting Sangla -Chitkul , I felt it was worth going by his advise . Kalpa is ok for one night , if you can reach by 11-00 AM from Sangla (2 hours from Sangla )
Hope this may help you
Thanks

bdchatt · Nov 2nd, 2009, 23:34

great suggestion pg...height gain may be problem..but regarding hotel and water, it's unpredictable..i'm going with best hope..in dec begining , chances of snow is rare before chitkul but still god knows about weather..
i would change my plan like this way ....
kalka - shimla - sarahan - sangla - kalpa - fagu/narkanda - delhi via shimla ,,,as i'won't book the hotel from here, then i can change my route depending upon the situation. it may be two nights in sangla or may be in kalpa ...
Is this flexibility expected from the driver ? I have to hire car on the whole tour but i think i can change the plan in between thoyugh i've to pay the full fare. Is it like that or i've to tell it to the agency ( surely ramchand) earlier?

pg66 · Nov 3rd, 2009, 13:48

Thanks bdchatt for kind comments
a) During Dcember there is no requirement of prior booking of hotel at Shimla , fagu , narkanda and saharan

b) For SANGLA and Kalpa , situation is bit different . Most of the private Hotels close down by end November in Sangla -Chitkul -Kalpa due to extreme weather and veryfew tourist . Lack of water is not the usual one as in Shimla but due to freezing, So you must have prior information about which hotels are open in Sangla -Kalpa - availability of acommodation is not likely to be an issue

c) Your trip will be Kalka - Shimla - Fagu -Sarahan - Sangla - Chitkul -Kalpa - back to Kalpa . So route remain the same for vehicle . Total trip length will not be more than 350x2 = 700kmin about 7 days ie 100 km per day for which they will charge Rs 2000/- to Rs 2300 /- (Sumo or TAVERA ) .
If you want to keep it flexible clearly write -up your option and get a written confirmation from agency (including RAMCHAND )
d) I could not undrstand about what flexibility you want from Driver as he will move ccording to your trip plan to agency . Off-course he will show you nearby place , sto as often yoyu want on te way but may not divert from your route plan unless it is a matter of only few Km
e) I will advise you to take Tavera if you are contemoplating Sumo as comfort is much more for about 200/- bucks more and will travel faster .

f) Remember it will be biting cold in December in Sangla . Even if there is no snowfall . even cloudy weather or short spell of rain can bring down temperature suddenly with chilling wind. TAKE ADEQUATE PRECAUTION IN FORM OFWARM CLOTHINGS AND CARRY DOCTOR'S BRANDY (in case you require )Sangla and Kalpa are very small towns and you may not even get addituional jackets /sweaters of suitable cut and size if you require . In fact I myself faced the problem and so this caution .
Wish your trip all success

thanks

bdchatt · Nov 3rd, 2009, 19:22

Thanks pg...
"Flexibility from driver" means change of route based on the situation or based on our demands. But from your reply i've got my answer. I must consult with the agency beforte final booking of car and will take a written confirmation. Regarding hotel situation in sangla/kalpa, may i get idea or current information from shimla ( car agency / hotel authority )?

nayan · Nov 3rd, 2009, 19:48

Flexibility from driver - driver will be in contact with the agency. he will modify the route in case of some change in situation(snaow fall, road closed etc). Usually the driver knows the locations and the route logistics far better than you or I do. So its often better to accept his suggetions. we too wanted to do kalpa before sangla but was disuaded by ramchand. Later we found out that his plan was far better than what we had initially planned.

Hotel situation - the agency/driver will have a very good idea about the hotel situation. If you go with Ramchand he will somehow manage to put you up in tolerable accomodation. Still contact him on this point ahead of time. Do not have too high expectations about accomodation/comfort in december.

indracal · Nov 3rd, 2009, 21:35

I don't think Sumo will be 2000/- per day in December. Tavera should be around 2200/- though, depending on your negotiation skills

. Sumo, IMO, should be around 1600/1700 depending on negotiation.

One of my associate booked a Scorpio during Oct (pujas) at 2100/-, so you should be able to negotiate.

BDC is going with friends, so bargain well and you'll get good prices.

pg66 · Nov 3rd, 2009, 23:29

I agree with Nayan . Local driver and agency has much better ground iformation update . In case of road blockade , agency /driver allows you to continue with alternative place . In Oct , when Malling was blocked due to lanslide , one of my friend , who was to make Kalpa-Kaza- Kunzum could not go beyond Kalpa . In fact , he came back to Rampur , took Jalori Pass to MANALI and had modified trip . HPTDC allows shifting of booking from one place to another without charging any cancellation fee.
But I still feel circumstantial changes and sudden change on demand mid-way are different and you should make it clear with agency .
Regarding accomodation , my suggestion is that Ramchand is reliable but there is no harm in these days of mobile telephony to get in touch and verify or clear your querries from the Hotel of your choice . But I again stress that take written confirmation of route , terms and rate including discount , if any , even from Ramchand .Ramchand is reliable .
Another point , I forgot - normaly agency from Shimla finds it difficult to pick-up from Kalka Stn due to Taxi Union problem , they prefer Chandigarh , so keep that option open . Infact it is easier also to get reservation upto Chandigarh in Kalka mail .
Thanks

bdchatt · Nov 4th, 2009, 22:19

good suggestion from everyone. thanks.
Sure nayan, local driver/people must have better knowledge on the road or current condition.
Does jalori pass remain open during first week of december ?
I'm going to Shimla by Sivalik Dlx exp..(though time consuming train journey, but i want to take the experience ). So car is required from shimla only.

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Oct 29th, 2009, 01:22	#31
pg66 Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: kolkata, india Posts: 46	Thanks bdchatt My tour plan was as follows 15 oct left kolkata by Rajdhani Exp 16 Oct reached New Delhi at 10 AM Did sightseeing in Delhi 17 Oct Delhi - Kalka by 7-40 AM Shatabdi Exp to reach KALKA at 11-40 AM Availed car to Shimla reached at 2-00 PM 18 Oct left Shimla at 10-30 AM to reach Sarahan at 3-30 PM (including about an hur halt for fuel , lunch , toilet etc ) 19 Oct Left Sarahan at 10-30 AM to reach Sangla at 1-30 PM 20 Oct left Sangla at 10-00 AM to reach Chitkul at 11-00 AM came back to Sangla at 1-30 PM , LUNCH left for Kalpa at 2-00 PM to reach Kalpa at 4-00 pm 21 Oct Kalpa and Roghi villiage , 30 min from Kalpa 22 Oct left Kalpa at 9-30 AM to reach Narkanda at 3-30 PM 23 Oct left Narkanda at11-00 AM to reach Shimla at 1-00 PM brief stop , left Shimla at 3-00 pm to reach Kalka at 5-30 Accomodation Shimla - Hotel White , nice view , clean , no kitchen and physially challenging to reach by foot . Very near mall is big plus . Rate 1350 /- plus 10% tax for room with private balconey Sarahan - HPTDC SRIKHAND , stayed in Super DLX rooms 1500 /- plus tax , lower rates available . Better than cottage . This is best accommodation in Sarahan , though bit expensive . Food very costly , try nearby chinese dhabas for ggod cheap food Sangla - Prakash Guest House , Super DLX rooms @ 750 Try to get Room No 301 in second floor . Hotel is half km out of main town but has pristene surrounding . Good food , reasonable rate , nice view . But rooms are small and bit cold . Kalpa - Kinnaur Kailash cottage @ 1700/- plus tax for 4 bedded suite . Very nice view , location , clean with room heater . Food very expensive .Kalpa has many hotels and a number of them are managed by bengalees , like Rakpa Regency , Golden Apple etc . Vehicle : As per many good recommendations of IMERs I contacted Ramchand for vehicle . He provided Tavera . Rate 2300/- per day all inclusive , but he provided a small discount . Driver was Satpal , whom I specificallly mentioned . My advice - 1)Speak and negotiate with Ramchand over phone but take email confirmation about rate , advance to be paid . However Ramchand is a nice young man , who tries to provide good service . Satpal is reliable and safe . 2)Whatever you save from vehicle hire charge , please give some allowances to the driver and insist that he stays in a room and not in car . Please remember , driver is the key person for your safe journey and not a good car or reliable travel agent . He needs to be in fresh body and mind next day to drive you safely in difficult terrain 3)Drink Mineral water I will post my tour report with photos in a few days , however any querry is welcome Thanks

Oct 30th, 2009, 00:58	#32
bdchatt smooth roads never make a good driver Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: kolkata Posts: 17	Too good information for me and i must remember pg's advice. My plan looks like : 4th Dec : Kalka mail from howrah 5th Dec : train 6th Dec : Early morning Kalka then Shimla by Shivalik Dlx exp. 7th Dec : Narkanda 8th Dec ; Kalpa 9th Dec : Kalpa 10th Dec: sangla 11th Dec: Sarahan 12th Dec: Shimla 13th Dec: Delhi by volvo 14th Dec: Duronto Exp. from Delhi 15th Dec: Kolkata Now my confusion is , i. Is the plan Ok ? ii. i've seen that people usually go through the route, you travelled. My plan is little bit different. Is there any problem to go first Kalpa from narkanda and lastly from sarahan to shimla ?

Oct 30th, 2009, 18:16	#34
bdchatt smooth roads never make a good driver Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: kolkata Posts: 17	very nice indra... i think i can attend last two aarti ,if i go from sangla to sarahan...

Nov 1st, 2009, 23:21	#35
pg66 Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: kolkata, india Posts: 46	My observation on bdchatts tour program a) Height of Narkanda 2700 m and Kalpa 2900 m I think you will be gaining height too much too soon from plains . It is advisable to stay at lower height like Shimla 2100m or Fagu around same height . b) In December , please check availability of accommodation at Kalpa and Sangla , even if accommodation available , whether water is avilable . Because of snow-fall at upper reaches piped water may not be easily available . c)Although I satyed at Narkanda , I thnk Peach Blossom Fagu has beter view of snow-clad peaks than Narkanda d) Since in December it willl be biting cold , it is better to gain height gradually and acclimatise with height and cold .My suggestion - Kalka - Shimla - Sarahan -Sangla /Kalpa -Kalpa/Sangla - Fagu - Kalka . e)It was Ramchand's advise to stay for two nights at Sangla . I ignored it but afer visiting Sangla -Chitkul , I felt it was worth going by his advise . Kalpa is ok for one night , if you can reach by 11-00 AM from Sangla (2 hours from Sangla ) Hope this may help you Thanks

Nov 2nd, 2009, 23:34	#36
bdchatt smooth roads never make a good driver Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: kolkata Posts: 17	great suggestion pg...height gain may be problem..but regarding hotel and water, it's unpredictable..i'm going with best hope..in dec begining , chances of snow is rare before chitkul but still god knows about weather.. i would change my plan like this way .... kalka - shimla - sarahan - sangla - kalpa - fagu/narkanda - delhi via shimla ,,,as i'won't book the hotel from here, then i can change my route depending upon the situation. it may be two nights in sangla or may be in kalpa ... Is this flexibility expected from the driver ? I have to hire car on the whole tour but i think i can change the plan in between thoyugh i've to pay the full fare. Is it like that or i've to tell it to the agency ( surely ramchand) earlier?

Nov 3rd, 2009, 13:48	#37
pg66 Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: kolkata, india Posts: 46	Thanks bdchatt for kind comments a) During Dcember there is no requirement of prior booking of hotel at Shimla , fagu , narkanda and saharan b) For SANGLA and Kalpa , situation is bit different . Most of the private Hotels close down by end November in Sangla -Chitkul -Kalpa due to extreme weather and veryfew tourist . Lack of water is not the usual one as in Shimla but due to freezing, So you must have prior information about which hotels are open in Sangla -Kalpa - availability of acommodation is not likely to be an issue c) Your trip will be Kalka - Shimla - Fagu -Sarahan - Sangla - Chitkul -Kalpa - back to Kalpa . So route remain the same for vehicle . Total trip length will not be more than 350x2 = 700kmin about 7 days ie 100 km per day for which they will charge Rs 2000/- to Rs 2300 /- (Sumo or TAVERA ) . If you want to keep it flexible clearly write -up your option and get a written confirmation from agency (including RAMCHAND ) d) I could not undrstand about what flexibility you want from Driver as he will move ccording to your trip plan to agency . Off-course he will show you nearby place , sto as often yoyu want on te way but may not divert from your route plan unless it is a matter of only few Km e) I will advise you to take Tavera if you are contemoplating Sumo as comfort is much more for about 200/- bucks more and will travel faster . f) Remember it will be biting cold in December in Sangla . Even if there is no snowfall . even cloudy weather or short spell of rain can bring down temperature suddenly with chilling wind. TAKE ADEQUATE PRECAUTION IN FORM OFWARM CLOTHINGS AND CARRY DOCTOR'S BRANDY (in case you require )Sangla and Kalpa are very small towns and you may not even get addituional jackets /sweaters of suitable cut and size if you require . In fact I myself faced the problem and so this caution . Wish your trip all success thanks

Nov 3rd, 2009, 19:22	#38
bdchatt smooth roads never make a good driver Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: kolkata Posts: 17	Thanks pg... "Flexibility from driver" means change of route based on the situation or based on our demands. But from your reply i've got my answer. I must consult with the agency beforte final booking of car and will take a written confirmation. Regarding hotel situation in sangla/kalpa, may i get idea or current information from shimla ( car agency / hotel authority )?

Nov 3rd, 2009, 19:48	#39
nayan Forum Leader Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: hyderabad/tokyo Posts: 1,930	Flexibility from driver - driver will be in contact with the agency. he will modify the route in case of some change in situation(snaow fall, road closed etc). Usually the driver knows the locations and the route logistics far better than you or I do. So its often better to accept his suggetions. we too wanted to do kalpa before sangla but was disuaded by ramchand. Later we found out that his plan was far better than what we had initially planned. Hotel situation - the agency/driver will have a very good idea about the hotel situation. If you go with Ramchand he will somehow manage to put you up in tolerable accomodation. Still contact him on this point ahead of time. Do not have too high expectations about accomodation/comfort in december.

Nov 3rd, 2009, 21:35	#40
indracal Wanderlust - but bills bug! Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Kolkata Posts: 514	I don't think Sumo will be 2000/- per day in December. Tavera should be around 2200/- though, depending on your negotiation skills . Sumo, IMO, should be around 1600/1700 depending on negotiation. One of my associate booked a Scorpio during Oct (pujas) at 2100/-, so you should be able to negotiate. BDC is going with friends, so bargain well and you'll get good prices.

Nov 3rd, 2009, 23:29	#41
pg66 Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: kolkata, india Posts: 46	I agree with Nayan . Local driver and agency has much better ground iformation update . In case of road blockade , agency /driver allows you to continue with alternative place . In Oct , when Malling was blocked due to lanslide , one of my friend , who was to make Kalpa-Kaza- Kunzum could not go beyond Kalpa . In fact , he came back to Rampur , took Jalori Pass to MANALI and had modified trip . HPTDC allows shifting of booking from one place to another without charging any cancellation fee. But I still feel circumstantial changes and sudden change on demand mid-way are different and you should make it clear with agency . Regarding accomodation , my suggestion is that Ramchand is reliable but there is no harm in these days of mobile telephony to get in touch and verify or clear your querries from the Hotel of your choice . But I again stress that take written confirmation of route , terms and rate including discount , if any , even from Ramchand .Ramchand is reliable . Another point , I forgot - normaly agency from Shimla finds it difficult to pick-up from Kalka Stn due to Taxi Union problem , they prefer Chandigarh , so keep that option open . Infact it is easier also to get reservation upto Chandigarh in Kalka mail . Thanks

Nov 4th, 2009, 22:19	#42
bdchatt smooth roads never make a good driver Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: kolkata Posts: 17	good suggestion from everyone. thanks. Sure nayan, local driver/people must have better knowledge on the road or current condition. Does jalori pass remain open during first week of december ? I'm going to Shimla by Sivalik Dlx exp..(though time consuming train journey, but i want to take the experience ). So car is required from shimla only.