Arthritis Sufferer

PeakXV · May 1st, 2008, 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by karuna

I don't understand the problem with evidence. If you went to your doctor with an ailment and s/he said "Take this pill. There's no evidence that it worked on anyone we've given it to before but hey, who needs evidence?" wouldn't you demand to be given something that they *know* actually works instead? Lack of evidence doesn't mean it hasn't been tested, it means it's been tested and found to not work.

As long as it isn't hills of pills & painkillers .... yes. Sadly it might be too much work, these days, for some sufferers & medical professionals to go through each individual diet and fine tune it for the optimum performance ..... especially with all the painkillers & tablets on the market these days.

And because diet is such a personal thing - it is unlikely that you will ever get universal 'evidence' or 'proof' from specific/specialized diets. Like federica, my family has also benefited nicely from scrutinizing food choices to reduce arthritic pain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by karuna

Like I said, healthy diet- the low fat, oily fish, fresh fruit and veg diet that we all know if not love-will indeed make you feel better. It will not prevent or cure arthritis*. Exercise - and this would include yoga- is also very beneficial, if not critical (the last thing someone with arthritis should do is remain immobile, although there are days, particularly with rheumatoid arthritis, where people feel utterly incapable).

Yes 'feel better' is what life is all about.

If you learn to put the right food in your body that minimizes inflammation and counteracts these autoimmune diseases et al then you are half way there - are you not? Once that is all in order .... then perhaps begin looking for other methods of ayurvedic/holistic or medical treatments to further enhance your health, mobility and overall lifestyle.

edwardseco · May 2nd, 2008, 12:13

Quote:

Do you really need 'hard' evidence. Common sense suggests eating a balanced diet with plenty of fresh fruit & veggies should give you the necessary needed energy to live a more healthy & active lifetstyle. In turn, daily exercise will insure proper blood flow to the joints. Eating too many acidifying foods like processed sugary foods, dairy, meats, coffee, alcohol, etc. will most certainly aggravate or enhance any existing joint pain and may cause additional problems further down the road

Well as my spouse says common sense isn't common. Besides, I need evidence to prove that we should go back to living in caves, burning widows and witches, etc..

amarama · May 3rd, 2008, 08:56

Aside from drinking plenty of fluids, get proper movement, even if all you can do is tap your foot. Nick, staying properly hydrated is not folklore. As you age your sense of thirst becomes uncalbrated. One fix is actually to force yourself to drink water until such a time that your thrist reseptors recalibrate.

Nick-H · May 3rd, 2008, 09:44

Quote:

Nick, staying properly hydrated is not folklore. As you age your sense of thirst becomes uncalbrated.

Oh! such lack of faith in the human body!

I do believe, as I think I posted earlier, that people moving to different climates need to drink more than may may think, but otherwise, thirst and hunger are just basic instincts.

Of course things can go wrong, otherwise nobody would ever become anorexic --- but for the average, reasonably healthy person the body is a self-regulating machine.

There is a trick every school child knows: decide to die by stopping breathing, and just see how long before your body forces you to give up the idea!

From an article in The British Medical Journal discussing common beliefs held by doctors that cannot be supported:

Quote:

People should drink at least eight glasses of water a day

The advice to drink at least eight glasses of water a day can be found throughout the popular press.w1-w4 One origin may be a 1945 recommendation that stated: A suitable allowance of water for adults is 2.5 litres daily in most instances. An ordinary standard for diverse persons is 1 millilitre for each calorie of food. Most of this quantity is contained in prepared foods.w5 If the last, crucial sentence is ignored, the statement could be interpreted as instruction to drink eight glasses of water a day.w6

Another endorsement may have come from a prominent nutritionist, Frederick Stare, who once recommended, without references, the consumption "around 6 to 8 glasses per 24 hours," which could be "in the form of coffee, tea, milk, soft drinks, beer, etc."w7 The complete lack of evidence supporting the recommendation to drink six to eight glasses of water a day is exhaustively catalogued in an invited review by Heinz Valtin in the American Journal of Physiology.w8 Furthermore, existing studies suggest that adequate fluid intake is usually met through typical daily consumption of juice, milk, and even caffeinated drinks.w9 In contrast, drinking excess amounts of water can be dangerous, resulting in water intoxication, hyponatraemia, and even death.

Of course we must all drink enough fluid. I still maintain that our bodies are better guides to this than the marketing departments of the water-bottling companies. "so many glasses/pints/litres a day" is nonsense.

grikoo · May 15th, 2008, 20:57

No impact exercise, like yoga, aimed at increasing overall mobility is the best cure.

My understanding is that glucosamine has no definitive studies at this time. Still, when available I take it every day with chondroitin and MSM (I have a bad hip) on the off chance that it's actually doing some good.

What has very dramatically helped in the past is the combination of the above supplements and a good quality powdered greens/algae supplement in quantities of several grams a day. After hardly being able to walk for a couple months, I went to feeling much better in about a week. I could actually feel it working in about 4 days.

In India, there is an ayurvedic drug, I forget the name, that's extracted from the resin of Boswellia serrata. It's related to, but quite different from, the iconic frankincense tree (B. carteri/sacra), which also seems to have similar effects. It's widespread in certain parts of India, and the forests around Hyderabad are full of it. If I'm not mistaken, I believe you can actually simply eat the resin too. The drug is a unique NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory) and help with the pain. Like most NSAIDs, it can cause stomach upset, so take it with a little food.

mousourik · May 15th, 2008, 21:30

In India, glucosamine hcl along with boswelia is available in supplement form that doesn't cause stomach upset.

theyyamdancer · May 15th, 2008, 23:53

I agree with the Boswelia being very helpful (I also have a bad hip) along with Devil's Claw (Harpagophytum) and Glucosamine Chondroitin. As for yoga - there is yoga and yoga - some of it works and some is too stressful for my body. But basically, whatever makes you feel good. Not moving is far worse than hurting. (I speak from bitter experience.) Fish oil supplements are also extremely helpful. I have tried MSM too but not sure if it changed anything. A POSITIVE attitude is the most important of all. Hydrotherapy works wonders if you can find it. Heat and cold alternating are very soothing. That is an Ayurvedic cure by the way. Alternate hot and cold water on the affected joint(s) several times when you are in the shower. Swimming is amazingly helpful. Meeting with other arthritis sufferers helps. Other people don't always understand, because it is invisible, you look ok and so are expected to move ok too. You need to remember to tell your friends that sometimes it hurts though you look exactly the same person as when you danced all night!

Sama · May 16th, 2008, 00:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by theyyamdancer

As for yoga - there is yoga and yoga - some of it works and some is too stressful for my body

very true. yoga is not one size fits all as it is taught in the west...you also have to find a teacher who can teach to "special populations", not just "health club yoga." you have to do your homework -- unfortunately, most people contemplating starting a yoga class specifically for a health issue, don't. they usually just pop into their local yoga class, find the class too strenuous or too whatever, then quit, then tell people that yoga did not "help."

finding the right teacher and finding the right class makes all the difference in the world, as I said here....Arthritis Sufferer

grikoo · May 16th, 2008, 21:27

Yes, I totally agree about the yoga comments. I was speaking more of the traditional, gentle yogas, rather than the strenuous types that have become so popular in the last couple decades. You could guess that anything put on directly by a health club wouldn't be appropriate.

Swimming- yes, another excellent no-impact exercise.

Tai chi is good too, but see if you can find a teacher for one of the forms that uses smaller, tighter movements. The big forms are a lot more stressful on your body than you might think, particularly on your knees if you have problems there. For the most part though, you can modify the larger movements and make them smaller, so even the big forms might be considered. This is done commonly for classes largely comprised of older people, where lower amounts of flexibility and mobility are the norm.

theyyamdancer · May 16th, 2008, 23:33

For Sama and Grikoo

Yes, we are on the same wave length. I am a dancer (modern, improvisation) but have been very keen at one time on Ashtanga Yoga which unfortunately is too focussed on hip-openings for me. My "guru" and yoga teacher switched to Anusara Yoga a few years ago which is even more focussed on the hips. So I practice gentle yoga on my own - a compendium of styles - and play it by ear. I am particularly interested in the work of Mukunda Stiles, yoga therapy. Fortunately in our style of dance it is more about self-expression than doing the splits! But my ego would still like me to be able to achieve full lotus "in another life"... LOL

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May 3rd, 2008, 08:56	#18
amarama Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: very near the Mexican border Posts: 154	Aside from drinking plenty of fluids, get proper movement, even if all you can do is tap your foot. Nick, staying properly hydrated is not folklore. As you age your sense of thirst becomes uncalbrated. One fix is actually to force yourself to drink water until such a time that your thrist reseptors recalibrate.

May 15th, 2008, 20:57	#20
grikoo Wandering Aesthetic Join Date: May 2008 Location: Here Posts: 42	No impact exercise, like yoga, aimed at increasing overall mobility is the best cure. My understanding is that glucosamine has no definitive studies at this time. Still, when available I take it every day with chondroitin and MSM (I have a bad hip) on the off chance that it's actually doing some good. What has very dramatically helped in the past is the combination of the above supplements and a good quality powdered greens/algae supplement in quantities of several grams a day. After hardly being able to walk for a couple months, I went to feeling much better in about a week. I could actually feel it working in about 4 days. In India, there is an ayurvedic drug, I forget the name, that's extracted from the resin of Boswellia serrata. It's related to, but quite different from, the iconic frankincense tree (B. carteri/sacra), which also seems to have similar effects. It's widespread in certain parts of India, and the forests around Hyderabad are full of it. If I'm not mistaken, I believe you can actually simply eat the resin too. The drug is a unique NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory) and help with the pain. Like most NSAIDs, it can cause stomach upset, so take it with a little food.

May 15th, 2008, 21:30	#21
mousourik Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: KOLKATA, INDIA Posts: 132	In India, glucosamine hcl along with boswelia is available in supplement form that doesn't cause stomach upset.

May 15th, 2008, 23:53	#22
theyyamdancer Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Crete Posts: 63	I agree with the Boswelia being very helpful (I also have a bad hip) along with Devil's Claw (Harpagophytum) and Glucosamine Chondroitin. As for yoga - there is yoga and yoga - some of it works and some is too stressful for my body. But basically, whatever makes you feel good. Not moving is far worse than hurting. (I speak from bitter experience.) Fish oil supplements are also extremely helpful. I have tried MSM too but not sure if it changed anything. A POSITIVE attitude is the most important of all. Hydrotherapy works wonders if you can find it. Heat and cold alternating are very soothing. That is an Ayurvedic cure by the way. Alternate hot and cold water on the affected joint(s) several times when you are in the shower. Swimming is amazingly helpful. Meeting with other arthritis sufferers helps. Other people don't always understand, because it is invisible, you look ok and so are expected to move ok too. You need to remember to tell your friends that sometimes it hurts though you look exactly the same person as when you danced all night!

May 16th, 2008, 21:27	#24
grikoo Wandering Aesthetic Join Date: May 2008 Location: Here Posts: 42	Yes, I totally agree about the yoga comments. I was speaking more of the traditional, gentle yogas, rather than the strenuous types that have become so popular in the last couple decades. You could guess that anything put on directly by a health club wouldn't be appropriate. Swimming- yes, another excellent no-impact exercise. Tai chi is good too, but see if you can find a teacher for one of the forms that uses smaller, tighter movements. The big forms are a lot more stressful on your body than you might think, particularly on your knees if you have problems there. For the most part though, you can modify the larger movements and make them smaller, so even the big forms might be considered. This is done commonly for classes largely comprised of older people, where lower amounts of flexibility and mobility are the norm.

May 16th, 2008, 23:33	#25
theyyamdancer Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Crete Posts: 63	For Sama and Grikoo Yes, we are on the same wave length. I am a dancer (modern, improvisation) but have been very keen at one time on Ashtanga Yoga which unfortunately is too focussed on hip-openings for me. My "guru" and yoga teacher switched to Anusara Yoga a few years ago which is even more focussed on the hips. So I practice gentle yoga on my own - a compendium of styles - and play it by ear. I am particularly interested in the work of Mukunda Stiles, yoga therapy. Fortunately in our style of dance it is more about self-expression than doing the splits! But my ego would still like me to be able to achieve full lotus "in another life"... LOL

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