Anxiety and Malaraia medication

goangoangone

I picked up a private prescription for Doxycycline today from my Doc for 28 days supply. It costs £13 in boots. I'm hoping to be able to buy them out there as Doxy is on their Essential Medicines list.

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edwardseco

Well, I can't respond to the brain washing argument. Hey, notice that the Wall Street Journal raved over atremisian. Maybe they forgot to wear their aluminum foil hats that day..

drzog

One should carefully differentiate between treatments for malaria and [b]prophylaxis[b] of malaria. No herbal research I have found no matter what quality has mentioned use of herb for prophylaxis, however Artemesia annua -Chinese wormwood, is an interesting case ??could be extrapolated to have such properties?. Given recent interest in extraction and patenting active ingredients in Australia as a new antimalarial drug this is viable but certainly not proven. There are a number of good Artemesia compounds available in from western herbalists. However i am not recommending this as a sure thing. Please remember this isnt P.vivax we are talking about but P. falciparum the nasty one: Malaria is the worlds leading infectioius disease and infects at least 140 million a year, kills how many?....so lets face it, if you can afford Malarone take it, otherwise proguanil + chloroquin is probably slightly cheaper alternative. Interestingly i gave a client Chinese wormwood to take when in Laos some years ago after she refused all prescription alternatives and she had psychoactive effects off the plant extract =nightmares etc. Artemesia annua is of course closely related to Artemesia absynthium = good old green fairy/absynthe with many shared chemical constituents.
As for homeopathics well my tutor do not recommend its use as there is little or no evidence for its effectiveness. Again thats not to say it might not work but I am not a homeopath and I wont be going that road -caceat emptor. Personally my own plan is to take proguanil + chloroquin plus have Chinese wormwood tablets on hand if it is a serious mossy problem, -? in January not so bad?, of course Chinese wormwood is great for gut parasites too, but taking it long term is not recommended either. Not suitable for children or pregnancy.
I will post seperate probiotic post elsewhere, but these are also very effective at preventing Delhi belly.
Now as far as DEET goes, personally only a fool would spray toxic insecticide onto their skin = direct path to ones blood stream + liver. There are great natural oil alternatives that mossys hate that smell nice too: Teatree + Citronella is typically used here in Australia. The neem post was interesting. Dont poison your liver with any more chemicals than it already has been exposed too. A good liver function probably goes along way to preventing side effects from prescription antimalarials too. Consider a gentle liver tonic up to 3 months prior to travelling, even better go see a herbalist an get your body functioning a whole lot better 6 months before you go. Good general immunity and liver/gut functions goes a long long way my friends.

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http://drzog.blogspot.com

flosdiner@aol.com

All the responses although this topic have gone way beyond my original question and expectations, transformed into something so complicated I think if combined, it could be published in a scholarly journal! Very interesting information...

But to respond to the recent deet comment, I have a product I use called Bugsun. It is actually a childrens sunblock, combined with a small % of deet and has always been pretty effective.

So to drzog, the Medical Herbalist. Are you suggesting I am damaging my liver by using this product, because it is something which is supposed to be used on children and has been around for about 10 years? And the major company that produces such a product that solely targets children- there are laws and guidelines and research which must be completed before basically anything in my country(USA) is released. So wouldn't some evidence would be noted about a product for children that can cause liver damage?

This isn't meant to be argumentative. I just wear the stuff blindly. These are actual questions?

drzog

ahh forums do wander sometimes , thats the fun: we could always start a new thread if people are getting annoyed
this link is the most informative article I have found, a further summary is posted below my comments.

Deet

Deet appears quite well researched, however with a name like N,N-diethyl-3-methylbenzamide it surely aint natural. Unfortunately most research into chemicals suffers even more from corporate self interest than pharmaceuticals, there are many cases in point where the FDA has not recognised toxicity or that toxicity in humans differs from the animal trials etc etc. More than anything else we are the children of the chemical revolution of the 1950's.
I do agree that using it in small external doses for short term is low risk, however everything you put on your skin is effectively absorbed and arrives at the liver for detoxification. Whether the liver can handle this or not is the question. Children appear to handle it better probably because their livers are in better shape than ours hehe. As with antimalarials the publicity for chemical insecticides has alot of money behind it compared to some herbal oils. Anyway I hope you find the reading informative.

ps Google have opened a brilliant academic search engine:http://scholar.google.com/


J Am Mosq Control Assoc. 1998 Mar;14(1):12-27.

Pharmacokinetics, formulation, and safety of insect repellent N,N-diethyl-3-methylbenzamide (deet): a review.

Qiu H, Jun HW, McCall JW.

Department of Pharmaceutics, College of Pharmacy, University of Georgia, Athens 30602, USA.

This review is intended to provide the reader with an overview of the all-purpose topical insect repellent N,N-diethyl-3-methylbenzamide (deet), with emphasis on its pharmacokinetics, formulation, and safety aspects. N,N-diethyl-3-methylbenzamide is effective against a variety of mosquitoes, flies, fleas, and ticks, and its protection efficacy depends on factors such as type of formulation, application pattern, physical activity of the user, environment, and species and feeding behavior of the insects. It offers an inexpensive and practical means of preventing the attack of biting insects and, more importantly, the transmission of vector-borne diseases. In both humans and animals, deet skin penetration and biodistribution are rapid and extensive, and metabolism and elimination appear to be complete. As evidenced by over 4 decades of human experience and rigorous animal testing, deet is generally safe for topical use if applied as recommended, although it has occasionally been related to side effects such as toxic encephalopathy, seizure, acute manic psychosis, cardiovascular toxicity, and dermatitis, along with a few cases of death due to extensive skin absorption. N,N-diethyl-3-methylbenzamide may compete in metabolism with and alter the biodistribution properties of other compounds to which a subject is simultaneously exposed, resulting in an added risk of side effects. The appropriate use of formulation techniques and new formulation excipients not only offers a way to extend the duration of protection, but also reduces deet skin penetration. In addition to extended repellency, minimal skin penetration of deet should be an important consideration in the evaluation of a deet formulation during new product development.

goangoangone

Good posts drzog.
A lot of folk seem to play down the seriousness of Malaria.

drzog

Thanks, trying to keep it real.
The stats are more accurately according to CDC: threatens the lives of about 40% of the world's population, infects 300 to 500 million people and causes over one million deaths each year worldwide. Something to consider. Dont ruin your holiday by getting bitten.

goangoangone

This is the one I found interesting
http://www.malaria-reference.co.uk/



under Advisory Service
Guidelines for health professionals Malaria prevention guidelines for British travellers.

drzog

getting back to the original topic of medications, I just wanted to add that Larium is of course the one that can cause psychologic distress, nightmares etc etc. SO yes especially if already on antidepressants or antianxiety medications one to avoid:
Doxycycline is pure antibiotic, and does appear effective against falciparum (although I have previously been advised in the Solomons to combo it with chloroquin) and although it may via its effect on your livers processing your hormones and other body chemicals effect your moods it is more likely to cause tummy upset, nausea, diarrhoea, and of course the sunsensitivity. I have had these problems with it myself in the Solomons- an area infamous for its malaria. IN the end i tolerated it but it didnt do much for the enjoyment of the delicious food available. It may kill off your good bowel bugs (and also some Delhi belly ones too!) but IF one takes probiotics then some of these problems may be improved, and your bowel will like you better. However general cautions aside most people can tolerate it if ones liver isnt in too bad a shape.
Some general cautions however: Do not take iron supplements, multivitamins, calcium supplements, antacids, or laxatives within 2 hours of taking doxycycline. These products may decrease the effectiveness of doxycycline. Also as a drug that effects the liver enzymes it will effect other medications (and herbs) that you take, so check in with your travel Dr of course. especially note: Doxycycline may also decrease the effectiveness of birth control pills.

Ok glad thats out of my system, have fun out there

Padma

Drzog,

You mention a good liver tonic 3 months before you go, can you give me any more info/recommendations. I got pretty sick last time I was over there (I work with kids who are alwasy ill and delighfully infectious) and I want to do all I can to get my system strong before this trip.

I used DEET and a mozzie net last time I was in India as I had a nasty reaction to anti-malarials (throwing up constantly) and I would love to switch to tea-tree/citronella. Does nayone know if geranium also good for this?

Padma

drzog

Pls see pvt message re herbs:
The more I research it the more I think a point to make with non DEET teatree/citronella oils is that one needs to apply the stuff every 30-60 minutes religiously during mossy feeding times.



The following is taken from Mosquitoes and Mosquito Repellents
A Clinician's Guide Mark S. Fradin, Annals of Internal Medicine 1998

However an additional option is to have permethrin soaked clothing or mossy nets.Pyrethrum is a powerful, rapidly acting insecticide, originally derived from the crushed and dried flowers of the daisy Chrysanthemum cinerariifolium. Permethrin is a human-made synthetic pyrethroid. It does not repel insects but works as a contact insecticide, causing nervous system toxicity that leads to the death or "knockdown" (out of the air) of the insect. The chemical is effective against mosquitoes, flies, ticks, and chiggers. Permethrin has low toxicity in mammals, is poorly absorbed by the skin, and is rapidly inactivated by ester hydrolysis .

Permethrin should be applied directly to clothing or other fabrics (such as tent walls or mosquito nets), not to skin. The spray form is nonstaining, nearly odorless, and resistant to degradation by heat or sun and maintains its potency for at least 2 weeks, even through several launderings. The combination of permethrin-treated clothing and skin application of a DEET-based repellent creates a formidable barrier against mosquito bites. In a field trial conducted in Alaska, persons wearing permethrin-treated uniforms and a polymer-based 35% DEET product had more than 99.9% protection (1 bite/h) over 8 hours, even under conditions of intense biting pressures; unprotected persons received an average of 1188 bites/h!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
To apply to clothing, spray each side of the fabric (outdoors) for 30 to 45 seconds, just enough to moisten it. Allow the garment to dry for 2 to 4 hours before wearing it.

Im certainly taking some for my net.



Geranium oil has had a couple of studies done in the Bite Blocker formulation with quite good results: Bite Blocker (Consep, Inc., Bend, Oregon) is a plant-based repellent that was released in the United States in 1997. Bite Blocker combines soybean oil, geranium oil, and coconut oil. Studies conducted at the University of Guelph, Ontario, Canada, showed that this product gave more than 97% protection against Aedes mosquitoes under field conditions, even 3.5 hours after application. During the same period, a 6.65% DEET-based spray afforded 86% protection, and Avon Skin-So-Soft citronella-based repellent gave only 40% protection. A second study showed that Bite Blocker provided a mean of 200 +/- 30 minutes of complete protection from mosquito bites.

Has anyone tried Bite Blocker? Sounds like the good oil lol
ANd what of the famous Indian potion Odomos? WEll a web search reveals it contains DEET- sorry guys;

For all the talk about Malaria as one poster mentions Dengue is also around- and the only way to not get Dengue is to not get bitten.
OK so we are getting there huh.
Until next time

Nick-H

These things always tend to come in small bottles at a high price. Is there a from in which Permethrin can be bought which is large enough and cheap enough to allow spraying all fresh clothes (ie every day) before wearing them?

[a few minutes later...] Hmmm, Google gives lots of stuff. I will go and come...

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goangoangone

Yes, it would be nice to know you're doing someone else a favour if one of the little buggers lands on you

Wanderer22

Looks like Permethrin has problems of its own. Permethrin info
I guess one just does their best, while trying not to be too paranoid.
We may all be playing Russian roulette with our health while travelling, but the idea is NOT to use an automatic!

Wanderer22

nomadelmundo

larium vs doxy
once a week vs once daily
bad dreams / psychosis vs bad skin burn
good for malaria vs good for malaria and some STDs


just a side note:
my best friend llok larium and made him an a$$hole to travel with on the days he took it, but i had no effects and drank alchol with it!

w

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