Traveling between Pakistan and India

Manicek · Sep 9th, 2003, 14:56

Hello!

According to many travel publications there should be only one border crossing between India and Pakistan (between cities Lahore and Amritsar near Attari). Although there are still serious political tensions between both countries will Pakistani and Indian goverments consider in future to open another border crossings for example on the south near Karachi(some world atlases printed in Europe indicate that there are perhaps some direct rail and road communications.)?

Thanks

PS. One maybe unimportant question . In October 2001 I flew back from Bangkok to Vienna and saw from plane in Indian-Pakistani border area orange shining line maybe at lenght 50 - 100 km. Does it mean that there is sharply patrolled border line with watch towers and fences made from thorny wire like it was between Eastern and Western Germany or Czechoslovakia and Austria till 1989(But only from eastern side to stop refugees to escape to West for democratic life). Are these barriers(wired fence) from both sides or only from one(India or Pakistan).

Thanks also for this maybe unessential question

steven_ber · Sep 9th, 2003, 16:02

I can give a little info about the railway.

I think the line from Jodhpur - Karachi via Luni, Barmer and Hyderabad was the southernmost train route to connect India with Pakistan.

Many things may prevent this line opening again.

1,- The Indian and Pakistani governments are in disagreement about re-starting the Amritsar - Lahore train service, they also disagree about extra bus services between Delhi/Ajmer and Lahore, there is only one bus running between Delhi and Lahore.

2,- The rail tracks between Luni and Barmer are currently being converted from metre gauge (MG) to broad gauge (BG)(this will allow direct trains to Barmer from Jodhpur, Jaipur and possibly Delhi), if the rail tracks from Barmer to the border still exist they will be MG so they would need to be changed to BG, I don't know what gauge they use in southern Pakistan.

3,- If ever this route were reopened, it would be an easy and attractive target for terrorists.

4,- I think all major issues between India and Pakistan would need to be resolved (to the satisfaction of both Hindu and Muslim extremists) before this line could ever be considered.

On a lighter note, the Pakistani transport minister/spokesman said last week that he would like to have a direct train service between Lahore and Dhaka, this idea is perhaps 35 years late, and it might be a good idea to get a service running to Amritsar first.

On the same subject, there is only about 50 km of track to be laid before a direct service from Dhaka to Benapole would be possible, this would make direct trains between Dhaka and Calcutta possible.

steven_ber · Oct 28th, 2003, 14:42

Track’s being laid for the train to Pakistan.

Gauge conversion on, 2500 km to Sindh will be just 100 km from Barmer.

NEW DELHI, OCTOBER 23: New Delhi’s offer to open the old Munabao-Khokrapar rail link between Rajasthan and Sindh in Pakistan has prompted the Railway to step up work on gauge conversion of the tracks. Word’s gone out that if there’s a yes from Islamabad then the Railway should be in a position to reactivate the link within weeks.

The re-opening of the link — it has not been used ever since the 1965 war — will be a big help for people on either side of the Rajasthan-Sindh border. Just 100 km separates Barmer from towns in Sindh but people have had to take the circuitous route via the Punjab border to get to the other side. Before Partition, it was the Munabao-Khokrapar link which served the trade route to Karachi port via Hyderabad in Sindh.

Full Story.

volga_volga · Apr 16th, 2004, 11:26

Quote:

Originally posted by trvl_in
Dec 1/03

A brief quote from today's news...

By LAURINDA KEYS, Associated Press Writer

NEW DELHI - India and Pakistan agreed on Monday to restore airline overflight and landing rights by Jan. 1, two years after the South Asian nuclear rivals ended all transportation links amid tensions that took them to the brink of war.
===

...a good sign...

the last internet article said that that India and Pakistan will introduce flights btw Karachi and Delhi, among others (currently there are none, only Karachi to Mumbai). Does anyone know developments? I am looking to fly Karachi- Delhi in late September.

Volga

volga_volga · Apr 16th, 2004, 11:27

also would appreciate updates on the overland crossing Amritsar to Lahore - trains? buses? frequency?

SHIMLA · Apr 16th, 2004, 14:41

Quote:

Originally posted by volga_volga
also would appreciate updates on the overland crossing Amritsar to Lahore - trains? buses? frequency?

Northern Railway's release dated Dec.30,2003, provides details of the train:

New Delhi.

Dated 30-12-2003.

DELHI –ATTARI BI-WEEKLY SPECIAL TRAIN WILL RUN FROM 14.1.2004 AND ATTARI-LAHORE SAMJHOTA EXPRESS FROM 15-1-2004

Ministry of Railways has decided to restore the Delhi-Attari bi-weekly special train no. 4001/4002 to run from 14.1.2004 and the Attari-Lahore Samjhota Express Train No.4607/4608 from 15-1-2004 as per the following programme:-

The special train no. 4001 (Delhi-Attari) will depart from Delhi Jn. on every Wednesday and Sunday at 9.00 p.m. to reach Attari at 4.40 a.m. the next day of its departure. In return direction the special train no. 4002 will run from Attari station from 15.1.2004 on every Thursday and Monday at 8.05 p.m. to reach Delhi Jn. at 3.35 a.m. the next day of its departure.

The 4607Attari-Lahore Samjhota Express will depart from Attari at 1.30 p.m. on every Thursday and Monday from 15-1-2004. In the return direction the 4608 Lahore-Attari Samjhota Express will depart from Lahore at 8.00 a.m. on every Thursday and Monday from 15-1-2004 to and reach Attari at 12.30 p.m.

The Attari special Express train will have four second sleeper class , ten general second class and two brake vans coaches and the Samjhota Express will have one second sleeper, seven general second class and two luggage van coaches.

volga_volga · Apr 16th, 2004, 14:49

Quote:

Originally posted by steven_ber
I can give a little info about the railway.

3,- If ever this route were reopened, it would be an easy and attractive target for terrorists.

have just noted Steven's comment... hope nothing has happened on the Attari-Lahore train, since its opening

?

basically am trying to gauge how safe it is

volga_volga · Apr 16th, 2004, 15:53

One more (may be very stupid) question. There is a road on a map between Srinagar (India-administered Kashmir) and Muzaffarabad (Azad Kashmir).

any idea if it is possible to cross the border via this route?

this one would be absolutely worth the risk!!! vs Amritsar-Lahore

volga_volga · Apr 16th, 2004, 23:16

There is a hope for all of us:

Kashmir's long road to prosperity
Asia Times, 15 January 2004

URI - While few in Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) believe that the violence and bloodshed will end in the near future, several expect the likely opening of the road linking Srinagar, the state's summer capital, with Muzaffarabad in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir (POK) to transform their economy.
.....
The opening of the 183 kilometer Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, as mooted by India recently, will facilitate travel and trade between the two Kashmirs ie, the parts controlled by India and Pakistan. Several Kashmiris have relatives living on the other side of the Line of Control (LoC) that divides the former princely state of Jammu and Kashmir. If the road is opened, they could visit each other easily. At present, a Kashmiri living in the Valley has to travel to Delhi by road or air, and then fly or take a bus to Lahore, from where he has to then travel to POK. A bus service between Srinagar and Muzaffarabad would considerably cut travel time and costs.

Constructed over a 10-year period and thrown open for use in 1892, the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road was until 1947 the Kashmir Valley's main link with the outside world. It has remained closed since the India-Pakistan war in 1947-48. The road begins in Srinagar and runs through Baramulla and Uri in Indian Kashmir. It then crosses the LoC and runs through Kohala to reach Muzaffarabad in POK. The road has been extended to Rawalpindi in Pakistan.

............

The J&K government is already preparing for the opening of the road as it is keen to tap the economic potential that it promises. With help from Delhi, the government proposes to convert the existing highway into a four-lane expressway. The tourism department is said to be providing assistance and concessions to those interested in providing accommodation to travelers in their homes and in opening tea shops and restaurants on the route.

If the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road is opened, there is a possibility that India and Pakistan will start competing to show off the level of development and democracy that the Kashmirs under their control are enjoying. That would be the best thing to happen to the Kashmiri people in a long time.

Copyright 2004 Asia Times Online Ltd. All rights reserved.

full article:
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/FA15Df01.html

volga_volga · Apr 23rd, 2004, 16:19

India published Travel Plus magazine (India Today) MARCH 2004 EDITION had a large section on travelling to Pakistan (22 pages) with How to Get, What to See etc and GREAT pictures. I wish some travel mags in Europe did something like this one day, instead of yet another villa in Toscany or all-inclusive package in Carribean.

bijapuri · Jul 13th, 2005, 07:08

. . .and did they rebuild the burnedout bus depot?

Dr.Sue78 · Aug 9th, 2006, 13:30

I have heard that there is an area where the local residents cross back and forth along the Sindh/Rajasthan border area. Does anyone know exactly where this is?

claudius x · Jul 13th, 2008, 19:12

Hi, the border is open now since one year. The train starts in jodhpur, runs via Barmer (closed to Jaisalmer, at least not too far) to Pakistan. Thank God: Also BACK!!
claudius

Shiver me Timbers · Jul 21st, 2008, 11:06

Great news, is it open for foreign tourists do you know?

Sep 9th, 2003, 14:56	#1
Manicek Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 34	Traveling between Pakistan and India Hello! According to many travel publications there should be only one border crossing between India and Pakistan (between cities Lahore and Amritsar near Attari). Although there are still serious political tensions between both countries will Pakistani and Indian goverments consider in future to open another border crossings for example on the south near Karachi(some world atlases printed in Europe indicate that there are perhaps some direct rail and road communications.)? Thanks PS. One maybe unimportant question . In October 2001 I flew back from Bangkok to Vienna and saw from plane in Indian-Pakistani border area orange shining line maybe at lenght 50 - 100 km. Does it mean that there is sharply patrolled border line with watch towers and fences made from thorny wire like it was between Eastern and Western Germany or Czechoslovakia and Austria till 1989(But only from eastern side to stop refugees to escape to West for democratic life). Are these barriers(wired fence) from both sides or only from one(India or Pakistan). Thanks also for this maybe unessential question

Sep 9th, 2003, 16:02	#2
steven_ber Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: London, England. Posts: 9,196	I can give a little info about the railway. I think the line from Jodhpur - Karachi via Luni, Barmer and Hyderabad was the southernmost train route to connect India with Pakistan. Many things may prevent this line opening again. 1,- The Indian and Pakistani governments are in disagreement about re-starting the Amritsar - Lahore train service, they also disagree about extra bus services between Delhi/Ajmer and Lahore, there is only one bus running between Delhi and Lahore. 2,- The rail tracks between Luni and Barmer are currently being converted from metre gauge (MG) to broad gauge (BG)(this will allow direct trains to Barmer from Jodhpur, Jaipur and possibly Delhi), if the rail tracks from Barmer to the border still exist they will be MG so they would need to be changed to BG, I don't know what gauge they use in southern Pakistan. 3,- If ever this route were reopened, it would be an easy and attractive target for terrorists. 4,- I think all major issues between India and Pakistan would need to be resolved (to the satisfaction of both Hindu and Muslim extremists) before this line could ever be considered. On a lighter note, the Pakistani transport minister/spokesman said last week that he would like to have a direct train service between Lahore and Dhaka, this idea is perhaps 35 years late, and it might be a good idea to get a service running to Amritsar first. On the same subject, there is only about 50 km of track to be laid before a direct service from Dhaka to Benapole would be possible, this would make direct trains between Dhaka and Calcutta possible. Last edited by steven_ber : Sep 9th, 2003 at 17:18.

Oct 28th, 2003, 14:42	#3
steven_ber Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: London, England. Posts: 9,196	Update Track’s being laid for the train to Pakistan. Gauge conversion on, 2500 km to Sindh will be just 100 km from Barmer. NEW DELHI, OCTOBER 23: New Delhi’s offer to open the old Munabao-Khokrapar rail link between Rajasthan and Sindh in Pakistan has prompted the Railway to step up work on gauge conversion of the tracks. Word’s gone out that if there’s a yes from Islamabad then the Railway should be in a position to reactivate the link within weeks. The re-opening of the link — it has not been used ever since the 1965 war — will be a big help for people on either side of the Rajasthan-Sindh border. Just 100 km separates Barmer from towns in Sindh but people have had to take the circuitous route via the Punjab border to get to the other side. Before Partition, it was the Munabao-Khokrapar link which served the trade route to Karachi port via Hyderabad in Sindh. Full Story.

Apr 16th, 2004, 11:27	#5
volga_volga Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,459	overland route Lahore - Amritsar also would appreciate updates on the overland crossing Amritsar to Lahore - trains? buses? frequency?

Apr 16th, 2004, 15:53	#8
volga_volga Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,459	Kashmir - Azad Kashmir One more (may be very stupid) question. There is a road on a map between Srinagar (India-administered Kashmir) and Muzaffarabad (Azad Kashmir). any idea if it is possible to cross the border via this route? this one would be absolutely worth the risk!!! vs Amritsar-Lahore

Apr 16th, 2004, 23:16	#9
volga_volga Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,459	Srinagar - Muzaffarabad road There is a hope for all of us: Kashmir's long road to prosperity Asia Times, 15 January 2004 URI - While few in Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) believe that the violence and bloodshed will end in the near future, several expect the likely opening of the road linking Srinagar, the state's summer capital, with Muzaffarabad in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir (POK) to transform their economy. ..... The opening of the 183 kilometer Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, as mooted by India recently, will facilitate travel and trade between the two Kashmirs ie, the parts controlled by India and Pakistan. Several Kashmiris have relatives living on the other side of the Line of Control (LoC) that divides the former princely state of Jammu and Kashmir. If the road is opened, they could visit each other easily. At present, a Kashmiri living in the Valley has to travel to Delhi by road or air, and then fly or take a bus to Lahore, from where he has to then travel to POK. A bus service between Srinagar and Muzaffarabad would considerably cut travel time and costs. Constructed over a 10-year period and thrown open for use in 1892, the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road was until 1947 the Kashmir Valley's main link with the outside world. It has remained closed since the India-Pakistan war in 1947-48. The road begins in Srinagar and runs through Baramulla and Uri in Indian Kashmir. It then crosses the LoC and runs through Kohala to reach Muzaffarabad in POK. The road has been extended to Rawalpindi in Pakistan. ............ The J&K government is already preparing for the opening of the road as it is keen to tap the economic potential that it promises. With help from Delhi, the government proposes to convert the existing highway into a four-lane expressway. The tourism department is said to be providing assistance and concessions to those interested in providing accommodation to travelers in their homes and in opening tea shops and restaurants on the route. If the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road is opened, there is a possibility that India and Pakistan will start competing to show off the level of development and democracy that the Kashmirs under their control are enjoying. That would be the best thing to happen to the Kashmiri people in a long time. Copyright 2004 Asia Times Online Ltd. All rights reserved. full article: http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/FA15Df01.html

Apr 23rd, 2004, 16:19	#10
volga_volga Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,459	India-Pakistan travel India published Travel Plus magazine (India Today) MARCH 2004 EDITION had a large section on travelling to Pakistan (22 pages) with How to Get, What to See etc and GREAT pictures. I wish some travel mags in Europe did something like this one day, instead of yet another villa in Toscany or all-inclusive package in Carribean.

Jul 13th, 2005, 07:08	#11
bijapuri laid traps for troubadours Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Priustan Posts: 2,598	. . .and did they rebuild the burnedout bus depot? __________________ Focusing your life solely on making a buck shows a certain poverty of ambition. It asks too little of yourself. Because it's only when you hitch your wagon to something larger than yourself that you realize your true potential. Barack Obama lookit me!!!: http://www.flickr.com/photos/bijapuri/ Utube fuzzy logic: http://youtube.com/profile_videos?user=bijapuri&p =r

Aug 9th, 2006, 13:30	#12
Dr.Sue78 Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New York, New York Posts: 5	I have heard that there is an area where the local residents cross back and forth along the Sindh/Rajasthan border area. Does anyone know exactly where this is?

Jul 13th, 2008, 19:12	#13
claudius x Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: berlin Posts: 3	New Boder-crossing: South Rajasthan Hi, the border is open now since one year. The train starts in jodhpur, runs via Barmer (closed to Jaisalmer, at least not too far) to Pakistan. Thank God: Also BACK!! claudius

Jul 21st, 2008, 11:06	#14
Shiver me Timbers Dreaming of Palm Trees Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Dublin Posts: 1,503	Great news, is it open for foreign tourists do you know? __________________ Europe to India Overland Andaman's Tips Pakistan Tips Flickr Photos

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