Indians Conclude 200 Mile Protest

machadinha · Oct 29th, 2007, 04:18

Quote:

Sandeep Bhushan
Sunday, October 28, 2007 (New Delhi)

March of the landless reaches Delhi

In a throwback to the Satyagraha of Mahatma Gandhi, 27,000 dispossessed people marched hundreds of kilometers to Delhi, demanding land rights.

The march reached its destination, the Ramlila ground in Delhi on Sunday.

The protesters or satyagrahis as they call themselves, began their journey on the 2nd of October from Gwalior, some 350 kms away from the national capital.

''We are staying here till the government listens to us,'' said P V Rajagopal, Founder, Ekta Parishad.

Most of these people have been displaced by big projects like the Sardar Sarovar Dam, sanctuaries and national parks or are those who have been staying in forests without land rights.

... Read on at http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv...010:12:00%20PM

Sama · Oct 29th, 2007, 06:39

NEW YORK TIMES:

Indians Conclude 200-Mile Protest
By SAHER MAHMOOD and SOMINI SENGUPTA
Published: October 29, 2007

NEW DELHI, Oct. 28 — From a village in Madhya Pradesh State, in the heart of India, Gudiya Bai came here walking because, she said, she lost her land to a limestone mine. From eastern Orissa, Johny Bilyung came because most of his tiny plot was taken over for the construction of a dam. And from neighboring Jharkhand, Budhua Tanabhagat came because he has yet to get water from a dam that cost him half of his fields.

For 26 days, thousands of peasants like these have marched more than 200 miles to the capital with the hope of telling their government how they had been cast aside by this country’s roaring economic growth. They reached here this morning in an orderly, peaceful three mile-long procession. Most of them wore plastic flip-flops, and some said they were already on their third pair.

A spokesman for Ekta Parishad, or Unity Council, which organized the march, estimated a turnout of 25,000, which could not be independently verified.

Their principal grievance was over land, and their presence in the capital was a stark reminder of one of the biggest challenges facing India, as it seeks to balance the needs of a vulnerable countryside and the demands of economic expansion....

read more HERE

Aishah · Oct 29th, 2007, 09:00

Interesting post, Yogagal. The development of India is often at the exploitation or to the detriment of other Indians- it seems to me there is less thinking about the 'greater good' and more in the short term economic growth expansion. Not only true for India, unfortunately, happens all over the world. The good thing these days is the development of media and internet etc. The whole world very fast comes to learn of injustice etc. and hopefully media coverage helps to rectify, put an end to certain incidents.. or slows them down. Which may be the case when these huge rallies take place.
Unfortunately here, the people who suffer the most are always the poorest, the rural populations, and those with little say in the running of their areas.

capt_mahajan · Oct 29th, 2007, 10:28

In line with my oft repeated sentiment, that the natives are getting restless.

capt_mahajan · Oct 29th, 2007, 10:49

Thing is, with India having moved to a mainly urban service economy along with international and national pressures (ennumerated too many times by me elsewhere) the rural poor are being pushed into a corner.

With no real outlet for grievance addressal, except the streets.

The plot will thicken

Earthling · Oct 29th, 2007, 10:50

I think India can take a leaf out of li'l Singapore's Housing Development Board policies.

Home ownership runs 99% in S'pore.

Singapore used to be a little fishing village when the government decided to modernise and one of the first programs was home ownership.

The gov builds on State land - no land costs
The gov builds homes - collects money
The gov extends home loans - collects interest
The gov maintains the estates - collects money
People pay property tax - collects money
The gov develops the neighbourhood - home prices go up
People sell - gov collects transfer fee

This is just HDB housing, quite apart from the private condos, bungalows and maisonettes.

Space is limited in Singapore so they have to build tall. Space is as yet quite large relatively in the US so cities are sprawling affairs..

What India needs a combination of the 2. Super tall, super modern gov housing for those buying their first homes. And a world class private property law network that WILL prosecute shoddy construction, land grabbing, mafia, bid collusions, yadda yadda.

Bottomline - India needs a new law and order system. The bedrock of a democracy is law and order. Every issue in a democracy can be traced back to the law and order system. The British who bequeathed us with our law system have modernised the UK. We are still clinging on to an antiquated system that is at least 150 years old. Yes, we are opening up to the world, but it is in many ways not fast enough and not well-thought through enough.

Giving land away (Benami Poramboke land) must stop. Instead the gov has to empower people to buy world class gov homes.

Yes, you've heard all the bluster before, but it's really the only way to accommodate a projected 2 billion population in 3 decades..

Our politicians are not savvy enough, not educated enough, not diplomatic enough at the moment. They may be 'smart' (read crims) in the Indian context, but that won't bring India into the superpower status it longs for.

There is an interesting book title that comes to mind - Despite the Gods, the strange rise of modern India - or something like that.

To give it a li'l twist, I'd like to write a book and call it - Despite the Politicians, the incredible story of the world's largest democracy.

Ok, I'm off the shoebox

capt_mahajan · Oct 29th, 2007, 10:54

Singapore has an area probably less than the size of Greater Delhi, with a population less than that of a suburb in Mumbai.
(The population of Singapore is probably less than the people who travel by local train in Mumbai alone, daily).

And it is a totalitarian kind of State.

All said and done, their solutions will not work in India, and perhaps won't even be welcome here.

Earthling · Oct 29th, 2007, 11:09

Nope we don't want to backtrack on democracy into an autocracy (which is what Singapore really is).

But their home ownership program is probably the absolute best in the world. In fact, London who recently implemented the downtown road toll studied Singapore before going ahead with it. The point being that much of the world turns to Singapore when they have an urban development crisis.

Regardless of the size of their island, I think their policies are worth tweaking into an Indian context..

No need to re-invent the wheel n all that..

I'm sure you've visited Singapore on your travels Cap..

nomad · Oct 29th, 2007, 11:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by capt_mahajan

Thing is, with India having moved to a mainly urban service economy along with international and national pressures (ennumerated too many times by me elsewhere) the rural poor are being pushed into a corner.

With no real outlet for grievance addressal, except the streets.

The plot will thicken

I won't say that that rural poor are being pushed into corner, but they at least are getting ignored, systematically.
Indians actually love poverty, it makes it so easy to employ maids, drivers etc. and does not matter if she is just 12 years old and probably came to delhi from jharkhand via a broker and sold as a commodity by her parents. I think the government also think in the same lines. thats why we still dont have any insurance plans, no leaves for workers in small scale industry, truck drivers etc. it will push the manufacturing and transportation cost up and hamper the 10% growth target.

I am not against the development, industry, BPO etc. but if we keep ignoring the masses, we are heading in wrong direction. if your neighbors are hungry, you are not safe even when you have 10 armed men guarding your house.

capt_mahajan · Oct 29th, 2007, 13:36

Agree, except I do believe they are being cornered.. but maybe semantics doesn't matter so much here, our views are not dissimilar.

They are also getting more impatient. The television boom has exposed them to national events and advertising like never before; I do beieve that a mix of poor rural opportunities , empathy with sometimes extreme and violent solutions, a consumerist mindset and younger demographics have made them more restless, and impatient.

Eruptions because of this, political and otherwise... Mayawati in UP, Naxalites, the SEZ violence, this march...

This will get reflected in the polls somewhere. I hope only in the polls.

Aishah · Oct 30th, 2007, 10:17

Political parties use the problems of rural classes to gain votes - promise them this and that etc. But when they fail to deliver, riots start as seen by the disruptions of the Gujjars in Rajasthan. Also, rioting is started by political parties to gain them votes as happened here recently. The Polls are not a true reflection of political belief, uneducated poor people vote for the Party they think will give them the most benefit - often it is all lies.

edwardseco · Oct 30th, 2007, 10:30

Quote:

In line with my oft repeated sentiment, that the natives are getting restless.

Aishah has put it quite completely. Which party is behind it? Even when I see a "true" farmer movement I want to do a class analysis of which farmers are the lead. Such stuff has gone on for decades..

shashank.aggarwal · Oct 30th, 2007, 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by edwardseco

Aishah has put it quite completely. Which party is behind it? Even when I see a "true" farmer movement I want to do a class analysis of which farmers are the lead. Such stuff has gone on for decades..

I was out of this thread...as I was waiting for political mud slinging to begin..waiting for news papers...some party name would be mentioned there...

capt_mahajan · Oct 30th, 2007, 10:42

=crossposted=

True; but the rabble rousers get much easier support when people are angry. The nature of the movement may get academic once they hit the streets.

There is no 'true farmers movement', agree again. The day there is, it will be interesting.

Oct 29th, 2007, 06:39	#2
Sama a pain in the asana Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: the India inside my heart Posts: 5,462	Indians Conclude 200 Mile Protest NEW YORK TIMES: Indians Conclude 200-Mile Protest By SAHER MAHMOOD and SOMINI SENGUPTA Published: October 29, 2007 NEW DELHI, Oct. 28 — From a village in Madhya Pradesh State, in the heart of India, Gudiya Bai came here walking because, she said, she lost her land to a limestone mine. From eastern Orissa, Johny Bilyung came because most of his tiny plot was taken over for the construction of a dam. And from neighboring Jharkhand, Budhua Tanabhagat came because he has yet to get water from a dam that cost him half of his fields. For 26 days, thousands of peasants like these have marched more than 200 miles to the capital with the hope of telling their government how they had been cast aside by this country’s roaring economic growth. They reached here this morning in an orderly, peaceful three mile-long procession. Most of them wore plastic flip-flops, and some said they were already on their third pair. A spokesman for Ekta Parishad, or Unity Council, which organized the march, estimated a turnout of 25,000, which could not be independently verified. Their principal grievance was over land, and their presence in the capital was a stark reminder of one of the biggest challenges facing India, as it seeks to balance the needs of a vulnerable countryside and the demands of economic expansion.... read more HERE __________________ *My India, 2005-2008* BE THE REVOLUTION Last edited by machadinha : Oct 29th, 2007 at 09:07. Reason: merged threads

Oct 29th, 2007, 09:00	#3
Aishah She-who-must-be-obeyed! Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Jaisalmer Posts: 5,477	Interesting post, Yogagal. The development of India is often at the exploitation or to the detriment of other Indians- it seems to me there is less thinking about the 'greater good' and more in the short term economic growth expansion. Not only true for India, unfortunately, happens all over the world. The good thing these days is the development of media and internet etc. The whole world very fast comes to learn of injustice etc. and hopefully media coverage helps to rectify, put an end to certain incidents.. or slows them down. Which may be the case when these huge rallies take place. Unfortunately here, the people who suffer the most are always the poorest, the rural populations, and those with little say in the running of their areas. __________________ "Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forwards."

Oct 29th, 2007, 10:50	#6
Earthling Noob Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Gaia Posts: 94	I think India can take a leaf out of li'l Singapore's Housing Development Board policies. Home ownership runs 99% in S'pore. Singapore used to be a little fishing village when the government decided to modernise and one of the first programs was home ownership. The gov builds on State land - no land costs The gov builds homes - collects money The gov extends home loans - collects interest The gov maintains the estates - collects money People pay property tax - collects money The gov develops the neighbourhood - home prices go up People sell - gov collects transfer fee This is just HDB housing, quite apart from the private condos, bungalows and maisonettes. Space is limited in Singapore so they have to build tall. Space is as yet quite large relatively in the US so cities are sprawling affairs.. What India needs a combination of the 2. Super tall, super modern gov housing for those buying their first homes. And a world class private property law network that WILL prosecute shoddy construction, land grabbing, mafia, bid collusions, yadda yadda. Bottomline - India needs a new law and order system. The bedrock of a democracy is law and order. Every issue in a democracy can be traced back to the law and order system. The British who bequeathed us with our law system have modernised the UK. We are still clinging on to an antiquated system that is at least 150 years old. Yes, we are opening up to the world, but it is in many ways not fast enough and not well-thought through enough. Giving land away (Benami Poramboke land) must stop. Instead the gov has to empower people to buy world class gov homes. Yes, you've heard all the bluster before, but it's really the only way to accommodate a projected 2 billion population in 3 decades.. Our politicians are not savvy enough, not educated enough, not diplomatic enough at the moment. They may be 'smart' (read crims) in the Indian context, but that won't bring India into the superpower status it longs for. There is an interesting book title that comes to mind - Despite the Gods, the strange rise of modern India - or something like that. To give it a li'l twist, I'd like to write a book and call it - Despite the Politicians, the incredible story of the world's largest democracy. Ok, I'm off the shoebox __________________ I don't know with what weapons WW3 will be fought. But WW4 will be fought with sticks and stones. -Albert Einstein Last edited by Earthling : Oct 29th, 2007 at 10:59. Reason: typos

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Oct 29th, 2007, 10:28	#4
capt_mahajan (in charge of navel affairs) Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: India Posts: 10,568	In line with my oft repeated sentiment, that the natives are getting restless.

Oct 29th, 2007, 10:49	#5
capt_mahajan (in charge of navel affairs) Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: India Posts: 10,568	Thing is, with India having moved to a mainly urban service economy along with international and national pressures (ennumerated too many times by me elsewhere) the rural poor are being pushed into a corner. With no real outlet for grievance addressal, except the streets. The plot will thicken

Oct 29th, 2007, 10:54	#7
capt_mahajan (in charge of navel affairs) Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: India Posts: 10,568	Singapore has an area probably less than the size of Greater Delhi, with a population less than that of a suburb in Mumbai. (The population of Singapore is probably less than the people who travel by local train in Mumbai alone, daily). And it is a totalitarian kind of State. All said and done, their solutions will not work in India, and perhaps won't even be welcome here.

Oct 29th, 2007, 11:09	#8
Earthling Noob Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Gaia Posts: 94	Nope we don't want to backtrack on democracy into an autocracy (which is what Singapore really is). But their home ownership program is probably the absolute best in the world. In fact, London who recently implemented the downtown road toll studied Singapore before going ahead with it. The point being that much of the world turns to Singapore when they have an urban development crisis. Regardless of the size of their island, I think their policies are worth tweaking into an Indian context.. No need to re-invent the wheel n all that.. I'm sure you've visited Singapore on your travels Cap..

Oct 29th, 2007, 13:36	#10
capt_mahajan (in charge of navel affairs) Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: India Posts: 10,568	Agree, except I do believe they are being cornered.. but maybe semantics doesn't matter so much here, our views are not dissimilar. They are also getting more impatient. The television boom has exposed them to national events and advertising like never before; I do beieve that a mix of poor rural opportunities , empathy with sometimes extreme and violent solutions, a consumerist mindset and younger demographics have made them more restless, and impatient. Eruptions because of this, political and otherwise... Mayawati in UP, Naxalites, the SEZ violence, this march... This will get reflected in the polls somewhere. I hope only in the polls.

Oct 30th, 2007, 10:17	#11
Aishah She-who-must-be-obeyed! Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Jaisalmer Posts: 5,477	Political parties use the problems of rural classes to gain votes - promise them this and that etc. But when they fail to deliver, riots start as seen by the disruptions of the Gujjars in Rajasthan. Also, rioting is started by political parties to gain them votes as happened here recently. The Polls are not a true reflection of political belief, uneducated poor people vote for the Party they think will give them the most benefit - often it is all lies.

Oct 30th, 2007, 10:42	#14
capt_mahajan (in charge of navel affairs) Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: India Posts: 10,568	=crossposted= True; but the rabble rousers get much easier support when people are angry. The nature of the movement may get academic once they hit the streets. There is no 'true farmers movement', agree again. The day there is, it will be interesting.

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