India shortsighted about global warming?

nayan · Nov 6th, 2009, 22:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick-H

Another thing is that there is anything new or recent in India's participation in the world's environmental self-damage. Hasn't deforestation being going on since way back? Don't some of the laws that are supposed to, but never did, protect India' forests date into the earlier part of last century, before independence?

Nothing uniquely Indian about it. Heavy deforestation has happened all over the world during that time. Converting forests to farmland used to be known as "civilizing" the place.

capt_mahajan · Nov 6th, 2009, 22:16

Quote:

Interesting to note that this reporter finds China a lot easier to work with on pollution than India

Actually, a large part of the article is sympathetic to the Indian position, eg

Quote:

As a result, its per capita carbon emissions are miniscule — just 2.77 tons of CO2 equivalent, compared with 19.81 tons for the average American and 4.4 tons on average for the world as a whole. Less than half of India's population has access to grid electricity — and even those that do suffer frequent brownouts. There are just 12 cars per 1,000 people in India, compared to more than 800 in the U.S., and thanks to stiff taxes, gasoline and diesel cost more in India than in the U.S. or China. Even in their diet, Indians put significantly less pressure on the planet: Indians eat one twenty-fifth the amount of meat that Americans do, and their mainly vegetarian food source emits a lot less carbon. "India has gotten its income through very low levels of energy intensity compared to the E.U. or the U.S.," says Girish Sant, a coordinator with the Prayas Energy Group.

What the article says is:

Quote:

If U.S. diplomats consider India to be a major obstacle to global climate-change negotiations

and zere ze plot, it thickens. Perhaps US diplomats find that their country is hardly in an economic position to talk tough with - or about- China.

Sama · Nov 6th, 2009, 23:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by capt_mahajan

Perhaps US diplomats find that their country is hardly in an economic position to talk tough with - or about- China.

exactly. because China owns the US, although I don't hear any politicians admitting that

....

camelgirl · Nov 6th, 2009, 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by nayan

click on the profile of the user. there will be options like "add xyz to your buddy list" and "add xyz to your ignore list".

Thanks but it doesn't work for mods & administrators. Besides, I'm able to use my personal ignore function quite well. And Mach is right, would be very confusing to the coherence of the thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sama

exactly. because China owns the US, although I don't hear any politicians admitting that

....

Amazing isn't it. Even our wonderful Barry avoided meeting with the Dalai Lama recently because he's going to China soon. They really do own us! If we think our financial situation is bad now, the Chinese could send us back to the 19th Century if they decided to try to make us pay them back!! Yup, they hold most of the cards. But our current administration did not get us there, so I can't blame them--I also don't see it changing.

shashank.aggarwal · Nov 7th, 2009, 00:08

I guess Captains last post bottom-lines it all. The facts that I knew, however had no inclination to go looking for numbers or data, and hence stayed away from discussion.

Now look at the numbers and talk about India's shortsight or need to look at long term issues. India is going bonkers with development for last couple of decades, and is till no where close to the emission average of the world. Even if the the leadership is 'far-sighted', and decided to cut down, then it would actually have no impact on the world.

KABAARY · Nov 7th, 2009, 00:16

O go Nayan ! I await your response with bated breath ! Go for it gal....

The medindia site informs me that myopia is experienced by almost one third of the Indian population.

CliveG · Nov 7th, 2009, 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by KABAARY

The medindia site informs me that myopia is experienced by almost one third of the Indian population.

... and most of them are bus drivers!

camelgirl · Nov 7th, 2009, 23:00

This is timely, have to confess I don't have time right now to read the whole thing but I think it's a good article.

http://www.newsweek.com/id/221588

On this topic.

federica · Nov 8th, 2009, 02:39

Interesting article, camelgirl, especially as it goes deeper into Indian politics.

capt_mahajan · Nov 8th, 2009, 07:24

Interesting article.

Even a day or two ago, Singh made some appropriate noises. I think the idea is to defuse criticism at Copenhagen- not that anything much is likely to happen there, by the looks of things.

Much of the 'Newsweek' article is about promises for the future. I guess India could always slow this down if other nations do not meet it halfway.

capt_mahajan · Nov 8th, 2009, 22:32

Quote:

Three hours on this road from Baroda and you arrive at Danti – a fishing village just 12 km away from where Mahatma Gandhi led his famous Dandi Salt March. The car meanders through a dirt path into the village. And then, the unmistakable signs of climate change — nature’s unforgiving backlash to human progress — start to show. Between the sea and a row of sea-flanked houses, which ends abruptly, there stands an 8-10 feet wall erected by the government. In the near distance, one can spot wells in the sea, brick-layered walls embedded deep in the sand; the flagpole of a temple.

These are remnants of a village called Moti Danti, now mostly drowned in the Arabian Sea. Hundreds of fishing families from this village have permanently migrated inland. They are among the swelling ranks of global “environmental migrants” or “climate exiles” – people who have to leave their habitats because of sudden or gradual alterations related to one of three impacts of climate change: sea-level rise, extreme weather events, and drought and water scarcity. The quintessential non-combatants in the climate war, they are the ones who have contributed least to global warming, but whose lives and livelihoods are most threatened by it.

Quote:

India has long argued that it cannot accept binding cuts on emissions because western nations are the biggest contributors and it cannot “compromise” its economic development and the aspirations of its poor people for a better standard of living. Yet, we are neither assisting nor protecting the millions of poor already vulnerable to climate change. The Government of India’s National Action Plan on Climate Change (NAPCC), released more than a year ago, made no mention of environmental migrants or a plan to help them adapt to climate change. Meanwhile, there are early but sure signs of the doomsday scenario unfolding across India.

IN WEST Bengal’s ecological wonderland — the Sundarbans — devastating cyclones have pushed the Lohachara Island into the sea, displacing 7,000- 10,000 people permanently. In Orissa, which has experienced some of the worst coastal erosion in the country, entire villages have been swept away in a storm surge. In the Himalayas, where “glaciers are receding at the fastest rate in the world,” according to the Inter-governmental Panel on Climate Change, flash floods are wiping out villages in Ladakh and droughts are causing crippling water scarcity in Uttarakhand. In the monsoondependent Bundhelkhand area, successive droughts are similarly forcing full families to head to the cities for work. “Villages are there but there’s no life, land is there but there’s no productivity,” says SN Pandey, a natural resource management expert who works in Bundelkhand’s Tikamgarh district. “When people come back, they have mobile phones but no drinking water.”

Vandana Shiva, noted environmentalist, attributes the Indian government’s “denial” to two things. “One, it feels that if it takes domestic responsibility it will weaken its international negotiating position. This is not true. Second, if it acknowledges the impact of a fossil fuel-based growth, it will have to give it up and there are too many powerful corporate interests linked to the nonsustainable trajectory”.

http://www.tehelka.com/story_main43....1109exiled.asp

suricate · Nov 12th, 2009, 02:10

YAY, lets pollute away ...

Quote:

New data show that the balance between airborne and absorbed
Carbon dioxide has stayed approximately constant since 1850,
despite emissions of CO2 having risen from about 2 billion tons
a year in 1850 to 35 billion tons a year now.....

http://beta.thehindu.com/sci-tech/ar...?homepage=true

Sama · Nov 12th, 2009, 03:22

Climate change: Listening to the Voices of Rural Women

capt_mahajan · Nov 12th, 2009, 07:25

Quote:

Environment Minister Jairam Ramesh released a paper, 'Himalayan Glaciers: A State-of Art Review of Glacial Studies, Glacial Retreat and Climate Change' by VK Raina, India's senior most glaciologist, which states that the glaciers are not receding.

Quote:

“Most Himalayan glaciers are retreating. But some like Siachen are advancing and some like Gangotri are receding at a declining rate. However, there is no conclusive scientific evidence to link global warming or black carbon and the retreating Himalayan glaciers and that they will vanish in near future as propagated by the West. No abnormal retreat has been recorded,” Environment Minister Jairam Ramesh told reporters at New Delhi.

Quote:

The findings of the study, are in sharp contrast to the IPCC’s 2007 report which said that the Himalayan glaciers were receding faster than in any other part of the world and at the current rate of global warming, could disappear by 2035.

Ramesh however, said, “We are not challenging the IPCC. We have an alternate view. It challenges conventional wisdom and is not a political report. I would like scientists the world over to critique the report. They may debate the causes, but the health of the glaciers is very poor and the level of debris has reached alarming proportions. ”

http://www.merinews.com/article/indi...15787941.shtml

Nick-H · Nov 12th, 2009, 14:32

I guess that there must be so much

going on, worldwide, certainly not just in India. The no-climate-change lobby seems to be gaining ground fast. I guess they have most of the money.

Nov 7th, 2009, 00:08	#95
shashank.aggarwal The Fortunate One Join Date: May 2007 Location: Road Posts: 6,820	I guess Captains last post bottom-lines it all. The facts that I knew, however had no inclination to go looking for numbers or data, and hence stayed away from discussion. Now look at the numbers and talk about India's shortsight or need to look at long term issues. India is going bonkers with development for last couple of decades, and is till no where close to the emission average of the world. Even if the the leadership is 'far-sighted', and decided to cut down, then it would actually have no impact on the world. __________________ Spineless Travelogue - Around India

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
About cows and global warming...	Larkilli	Dogs, Cats, and Langurs	1	Apr 15th, 2009 20:02
global warming to dry up ganges	Sama	Chai and Chat	12	Dec 1st, 2007 20:49
Global warming needs Eco spirituals?	rangers	Chai and Chat	0	Jul 19th, 2007 18:44

Nov 7th, 2009, 00:16	#96
KABAARY Maha Guru Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: INDIA Posts: 1,261	O go Nayan ! I await your response with bated breath ! Go for it gal.... The medindia site informs me that myopia is experienced by almost one third of the Indian population.

Nov 7th, 2009, 23:00	#98
camelgirl 10 year Visa okee dokee Join Date: May 2005 Location: Swannanoa NC usa Posts: 2,032	This is timely, have to confess I don't have time right now to read the whole thing but I think it's a good article. http://www.newsweek.com/id/221588 On this topic.

Nov 8th, 2009, 02:39	#99
federica Maha Guru Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Bavaria Posts: 1,774	Interesting article, camelgirl, especially as it goes deeper into Indian politics.

Nov 8th, 2009, 07:24	#100
capt_mahajan Infidel Sufi Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: styx Posts: 13,601	Interesting article. Even a day or two ago, Singh made some appropriate noises. I think the idea is to defuse criticism at Copenhagen- not that anything much is likely to happen there, by the looks of things. Much of the 'Newsweek' article is about promises for the future. I guess India could always slow this down if other nations do not meet it halfway.

Nov 12th, 2009, 03:22	#103
Sama a pain in the asana Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: the India inside my heart Posts: 6,421	Climate change: Listening to the Voices of Rural Women

Nov 12th, 2009, 14:32	#105
Nick-H This is just a cameo appearance Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Chennai, India Posts: 36,180	I guess that there must be so much going on, worldwide, certainly not just in India. The no-climate-change lobby seems to be gaining ground fast. I guess they have most of the money.