"Don't go to India because ..." Prejudices and Misconceptions Collected

Exactly. Visa on entry in countries like Egypt means exactly that, you buy a visa stamp and stick it in your passport yourself, it is purely a tourist tax.

India, on the other hand, takes immigration issues very seriously and being qualified for visa on entry should definitely not be taken as a guarantee that it will be granted. (Edited to add: Not that applying for a visa in advance is a guarantee, though cases of entry refusal to those with the correct paperwork are rare)

Personally, especially as this is a new system, I'd want to see the statistics about refusal rates before I chose to rely on VOE.

And, wait, there's more...

Given that most long distance tourists travel by air (and especially to India), whether easing border restrictions would add to tourist numbers is irrelevant. To me, tourism reflects first a desire to visit, and second, the numbers of aircraft seats available to facilitate the desire. Where I live, the local tourism industry would eagerly support a 10-fold increase in international airline seats arriving each week. Fortunately, the Australian government has restrictions on the numbers of airline passengers arriving each week. And, as well, the airlines themselves restrict flights to ensure profitable capacity.

So, the issue of visa restrictions is not about tourist numbers, rather, I suggest it's about (1) managing visitor entry, and (2) ensuring undesirables do not enter.

So, the question that follows is: "Which system best prevents undesirables from entering a country? A Visa-On-Entry or a Visa pre-application system?"

I see no difference. Most modern western nations have Visa-On-Arrival. To it's discredit, the US and it's clone states (like Australia) have chosen to abandon the previously facilitated Visa-On-Arrival. Interestingly, the Visa-Before-Arrival did not stop terrorists entering the US to embark on rampage.

The idea of a tourist tax is not necessarily related to the issuance of a Visa. I understand that nearly every country has a tourist entry/departure tax. Most modern western nations enable airlines to add the tax to the cost of the flight so that the passenger need not fumble around at an airport seeking to pay the tax. And, having the airline facilitate the tax collection is a more efficient method of collection for the state than at each border entry.

The point I made initially is that Visa-On-Arrival makes a passenger's decision to visit a nation a little bit easier. To support my view, I add this... My wife and I are retired and are now at that stage of life where we seek to visit various places offshore each year. We tend to 'have' 3 or 4 overseas 'holidays'. With that in mind, I will say to her "where shall we go in September, here, there, or where-ever". In our discussions, several attributes are considered. Though low on the list, the attribute of Visa-On-Arrival plays a part. So, if we were at the stage of saying to ourselves "well, it's got down to country A or B" we often reflect on "which is easier to organise?". For us, Visa-On-Arrival makes travel so much easier. And, to reinforce my point, when I made my initial contribution on this topic (above) my wife and I had India as one of our 2 destinations but the 'hassle' of the Visa application (and the relatively expensive cost) made us choose against India.

My first point above was that airline entry capacity is used (in part) to restrict tourism. So, being 'overrun' by tourists will never be part of the equation. Given this, if a nation wants to increase tourism, then it also has to ensure airlines are willing to service the location. That said, I suggest airlines are generally unwilling to increase capacity where profitability is not obvious. The point I am leading to is that tourism demand will increase if (1) the destination is amenable (and India has much to offer), and (2) entry is relatively easy (and India scores well down on this scale). Only when tourism demand exceeds supply will airlines willingly seek additional flights. Thus, the lack of Visa-On-Arrival is a turn-off to enhancing tourist demand.

Bruce, I think you put the visa thing in the right context there. It is low on the list, but may be a factor in the final choice.

But what about cost of travel? I don't know how things are for you in Australia, but for my compatriots back in UK, visiting almost any part of Europe is astonishingly cheap, whereas a flight to India is expensive: tens of pounds against hundreds of pounds --- not to mention eight to ten hours flying.

Agree.

Visas are not even on our list when we consider traveling somewhere. They will always be a very small part of the overall cost of any trip. The possible hassles of getting them are, for us, part of the fun of planning a trip.

If we want to go somewhere, for whatever reason (we also are retired & try to travel alot), the top of the list is overall cost (airfare, hotels, etc.) (which is why Europe is now at the bottom of our list due to our still weak dollar, though it's a slightly better).

It would be lovely if every country gave an "on arrival" visa, but I don't really care if they don't, if I want to visit.

It may be just a bureaucratic, outsourced pain-in-the-neck now, but getting up early and joining the queue outside India House was certainly part of the fun for me. Well, ok, maybe not the getting up early... There was never any question; it was just a rubber-stamp fee collection.

Of course, if you are Indian, and applying for your visa to visit Europe or America, it is a dreadful suspense, wondering if you are going to get it or not. A very different experience.

I also used to live a bus/train ride away from New York City which had all the worlds consulates, which made it easy, exciting & a little anxious at the same time. Certain countries asked for "Religion" and I wondered what the right answer was for them to let us in. We were never refused a visa. Now most of the countries that required them in advance, let you get them on arrival.

It's an ever-changing scenario.

India always had the most hassles for everything, including mailing a letter (that's gotten much better). Hated it, loved it! You knew you weren't in Kansas anymore (Wizard of Oz reference).

Chiming in, a little sideways on the topic... I've had a number of people recently say "I'd never go to India if you weren't going to be there." It's just not been at the top of their travel lists, for some reasons that have been mentioned in this very long thread. No one's actually said "Don't go to India..." yet - but there's been a lot of "I'd NEVER go, but since you'll be there..." with the assumption that I'll be a tour guide, translator, interpreter, etc. for them. It may not be faulty, but... I am waiting to see how many of them get turned off by the tourist visa costs and process.

exscribere

Assuming you'd jump at the opportunity to take X people across to and around India, I'd assume you'd do it for the free travel, the free accommodation, etc. Then, you'd pack them onto the plane and go enjoy yourself. If this is correct, I'd also assume you'd organise their visa's as well.

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You would be assuming incorrectly... There's no expectation by me that my friends would pay for me. Will I show them around, sure - but I'm not expecting that they will pay my hotel room, train fare, etc. Meals maybe, but it's more a case of "They will come visit me, and are expecting I'll do things for free." I may do some of it gratis (why I said in the earlier post it may not be entirely faulty) but I'm not expecting a full ride. That's unfair to them.

I also wouldn't be able to organise their visas... if I'm in India and they're in Canada/US, they have to fill out their own paperwork and file it in their country of origin. I can't do anything there.

"Don't go to India... the paperwork will kill you!" ?

Don't go to India because if you think getting the Visa is too hard you won't be able to handle it! The visa is a dry run for doing India as an independent traveler. The visa cost? How about those plane fares?

Getting a visa is actually a secret test of how you'll deal with India.

The advanced test is booking a train ticket from abroad via irctc.com

Oh my god yes!

Exactly!

Yep, the plane fares are costly!

In my case US$475 return.

That's heaps more than the US$90 for the visa!!!


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