cross cultural relationships

lotus blossom · Oct 14th, 2005, 07:03

i'm not sure if i have anything to add that has not been said, except in the simplest way - the heart knows nothing of differences in ethnicity, skin color, culture, religion, sex, age, class/caste, etc. it is the mind that gets attatched to these things which then fuels ignorance and racism.

sure, there are differences in culture that could very well cause clashes in cross-cultural relationships, but in the end, if we accept and indeed celebrate those differences than the only problems that remain are the same ones that any couple faces.

crvlvr · Oct 14th, 2005, 07:25

Quote:

I'm a mutt. Half Swede and half Hispanic. Dark with aryan features, works well for us.

Shakti, just thought I'd point out that the use of the word "aryan" is frowned upon by some, given the Aryan Invasion Theory and all. well this thread is about cultural sensitivvity..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan#Racist_connotations

raos · Oct 14th, 2005, 08:16

Jesus, all this self-righteous, self-congratulatory crap is making me sick. I guess all you IMers are just better than most in the world. (I know not everyone is saying this...) Get over it -- if anything, this thread reveals how many ridiculous stereotypes people have here. I'm afraid you're not even close to being true intellectual, progressive elites; though perhaps by the narrow-minded standards of the internet you may have convinced yourself otherwise.

Anyway, to our friend from the Netherlands who started this absurd discussion in response to a benign OP, in a blatant example of male-only subjectivity (there's a book called The Second Sex you may want to read), you have conveniently ignored one of the primary elements of cross-cultural elements of western-asian relationships. That is, many asian women get to escape a patriarchal, sexist culture where they have little freedom and protection and marry into a culture that has far more (though not perfect) gender equality. What this has to do with India is unclear, since the Western-Indian intermarriage rate is (likely) relatively low. Heck, first generation American-Indians are still entering into arranged marriages, forget about marrying non-Indians.

If this starts a flame war, good, since maybe this thread will be shut down...

cyberhippie · Oct 14th, 2005, 10:31

Raos (I've got my mod hat on now) I'm not entirely sure what got you so upset about this thread but try and keep above the belt!!!
You can state your views like anyone else and they will listened to just like any other opinions stated here. Then people will go away and decide for themselves what's right and wrong!!
You can't change the world on a public forum, laying out your thoughts is the best you can do!!

Ok carry on............and keep it polite please!!

cfhi · Oct 14th, 2005, 10:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruins_explorer

Some of my female friends have developed a penchant for Asian men. The Chinese men of my acquaintance have been benefiting greatly from this.

hahaha really? GREAT~!!!! introduce them to me ~~~!!!!!heh heh

agni5454 · Oct 14th, 2005, 10:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by raos

Western-Indian intermarriage rate is (likely) relatively low. Heck, first generation American-Indians are still entering into arranged marriages, forget about marrying non-Indians.

India with any other groups (wether it is western, asian, african, european, etc) marriages are relatively low. Something to do with protecting their own culture i think.

cfhi · Oct 14th, 2005, 10:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duryodhan

Guys, this is an excellent discussion. By the way, I think some of you think I am white but I'm not. I'm of Indian origin but I grew up and live in the Netherlands.

Maybe I was hasty in some of my remarks e.g. regarding multicultural societies. All I can say is that here in the Netherlands they claim to be a "multicultural society" but it is a farce, and it becomes painfully obvious during election time when suddenly "the foreigners" are blamed for everything that is wrong in the country. Maybe the San Francisco Bay Area is genuinely different, I haven't been there for a long, long time so I can't comment on it and so I take back what I said.

But the fact seriously remains that at the lowest level, we all go back to our ethnic attachments. There might be exceptions, but in the end that's exactly what they are. I think it is absolutely fair to distinguish white, non-white or whatever. It's because we ARE all different. Ignoring that doesn't make it go away.

I think a lot of the people on this board are exceptions and I think that's what makes this board awesome. A few of you ladies replied to my last message and I agree with all your points. The thing is, you are exceptions. You're way better than the common person. Either that, or I'm just somehow surrounded by idiots. You would not believe how narrow-minded and ignorant...or just plain stupid...the common person is. The fact that we are even on this board puts us in another tier...how many people want to spend their time travelling and learning about other cultures? They are more interested in just going along with the rat race and sitting in front of the TV.

Another thing: a topic like this one would have degenerated into a mass flame war on any other board. But it hasn't happened here. I think that says a lot too.

Woah~~~ i agree with you wholeheartedly man~~~ most of those other boards will be up in flames now like what you mention..... heh heh

agni5454 · Oct 14th, 2005, 10:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by katyrafi

I do admit that I have seen many so-called cross-cultural marriages go sour very quickly - but that's not often because of the culture/colour clash - more likely that either the Indian male married a western woman for her money and/or to provide an escape route out of India or, conversely the Indian male married a Western woman to secure himself dinner on the table every night. False motivations and expectations in a marriage will lead to failure whatever the colour of the pair (in my humble opinion).

that is EXACTLY the problem with Russian women .....they come here and then dump their "husbands" and bring over their boyfriends from Russia.

hey_namaste · Oct 14th, 2005, 12:13

things about him: where's my choppers... (what the hell are choppers?? flipflops we call them)... numkee....so much tea drinking, saying yes to anything and meaning no....shocked at girl's freedom here, (which causes my dirtiest look ever)...realizing he's saying it to torment me, dinner sooooooooooooo late !! cuss words with an accent, the sound of him saying that SOB cracks me up, the list could go on and on and he could have one on me too ! -beachchikever

hey beachchik4ever!
i loved reading your post! it reminded me so much of the funny things my boyfriend does! it sounds like yall have a lot of fun!

agni5454 · Oct 14th, 2005, 12:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by hey_namaste

things about him: where's my choppers... (what the hell are choppers?? flipflops we call them)... numkee....so much tea drinking, saying yes to anything and meaning no....shocked at girl's freedom here, (which causes my dirtiest look ever)...realizing he's saying it to torment me, dinner sooooooooooooo late !! cuss words with an accent, the sound of him saying that SOB cracks me up, the list could go on and on and he could have one on me too ! -beachchikever

hey beachchik4ever!
i loved reading your post! it reminded me so much of the funny things my boyfriend does! it sounds like yall have a lot of fun!

"yall"

sounds like you are from the South; thats used more commonly in the southern states

hey_namaste · Oct 14th, 2005, 12:25

haha yeah, texas.
sometimes i let it slip. hehe.

my indian boyfriend even says it sometimes...

i guess he's pretty much adapted to texan culture. hehe.

Oct 14th, 2005, 13:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by raos

Jesus, all this self-righteous, self-congratulatory crap is making me sick. I guess all you IMers are just better than most in the world. (I know not everyone is saying this...) Get over it -- if anything, this thread reveals how many ridiculous stereotypes people have here. I'm afraid you're not even close to being true intellectual, progressive elites; though perhaps by the narrow-minded standards of the internet you may have convinced yourself otherwise.

Anyway, to our friend from the Netherlands who started this absurd discussion in response to a benign OP, in a blatant example of male-only subjectivity (there's a book called The Second Sex you may want to read), you have conveniently ignored one of the primary elements of cross-cultural elements of western-asian relationships. That is, many asian women get to escape a patriarchal, sexist culture where they have little freedom and protection and marry into a culture that has far more (though not perfect) gender equality. What this has to do with India is unclear, since the Western-Indian intermarriage rate is (likely) relatively low. Heck, first generation American-Indians are still entering into arranged marriages, forget about marrying non-Indians.

If this starts a flame war, good, since maybe this thread will be shut down...

Well, I do agree that there's nothing more nauseating than a mutual admiration society and it wasn't my intention to go in that direction. I just pointed out an observation and apparently that bursted your bubble.

I'm not saying I'm a part of some intellectual, progessive elite. But come on, you come on here telling me to read "The Second Sex" - a feminist book based on Freudian psychoanalysis? That doesn't even qualify as psuedo-science, let alone even remotely intelligent.

Furthermore, you being a guy and recommending that book...maybe you've got some serious issues?

It's true that a lot of Indian-Americans still enter arranged marriages. But you'd be very surprised as to the reasons. You don't know as much about the Indian diaspora as you think you do.

Oct 14th, 2005, 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruins_explorer

I actually did a lot of deep thinking about your comments today, and here's my thought - all the people I hang out with from different ethnicities and whatnot have all been acculturated as Americans. Furthermore, they are all within my same social class, having at least a college education if not more, and we also could all be considered members (or past members) of a particular subculture. So even when you put race aside, people still are attracted to and want to spend time with people who are similar to them. My mom commented at our wedding on how diverse the crowd was, but that's externally. We're friends because we listen to the same music, like the same movies, enjoy doing the same things, etc.

I don't think race is necessarily always the distinguishing factor, but you're still right - we're all different and our differences should not be ignored as a factor.

Great post! I agree with what you're saying. And I've had exactly the same experiences regarding subcultures and how people form those subcultures.

I've also had experiences where you discover a level right below the subculture and it always seems to be based on race. Say you have a quarrel within your subculture, I swear to you that I've always seen sub-groups form based on ethnic background...even before religion and what not. So you could have two Muslims, say an Arab and a Pakistani. And they will NOT stick together even though they are both Muslim or whatever, they will stick with their respective ethnic groups, even if other members of that group are not even religious or have even radically different viewpoints.

Interesting, isn't it?

Ravibagal · Oct 14th, 2005, 14:18

I have many Indian friends who have married white females including my brother. Most of their marriages broke up after 10-12 years as the white females tend to age very badly and the Indian guys seem to have no problem getting younger women or have no problem cheating on their spouses. I think most Indians or Asians in general do not age as badly as the caucasians. A 30 year old Caucasian woman looks like 50+ when compared to an Asian or an Indian. Most guys do not want to look like he's with Grandma. Sad but true...looks do matter. Many Indians marry white females for either a Passport or to show off but after a while they get tired of the relationship for different reasons.

SHIMLA · Oct 14th, 2005, 15:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by cyberhippie

Ok carry on............and keep it polite please!!

Ditto !

And avoid the personal remarks too.

Oct 14th, 2005, 07:03	#46
lotus blossom re-member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: blowin' in the wind Posts: 1,883	i'm not sure if i have anything to add that has not been said, except in the simplest way - the heart knows nothing of differences in ethnicity, skin color, culture, religion, sex, age, class/caste, etc. it is the mind that gets attatched to these things which then fuels ignorance and racism. sure, there are differences in culture that could very well cause clashes in cross-cultural relationships, but in the end, if we accept and indeed celebrate those differences than the only problems that remain are the same ones that any couple faces. __________________ Not all who wander are lost

Oct 14th, 2005, 12:13	#54
hey_namaste Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: USA Posts: 30	i love it! things about him: where's my choppers... (what the hell are choppers?? flipflops we call them)... numkee....so much tea drinking, saying yes to anything and meaning no....shocked at girl's freedom here, (which causes my dirtiest look ever)...realizing he's saying it to torment me, dinner sooooooooooooo late !! cuss words with an accent, the sound of him saying that SOB cracks me up, the list could go on and on and he could have one on me too ! -beachchikever hey beachchik4ever! i loved reading your post! it reminded me so much of the funny things my boyfriend does! it sounds like yall have a lot of fun!

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Oct 14th, 2005, 08:16	#48
raos Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: U.S. Posts: 199	Jesus, all this self-righteous, self-congratulatory crap is making me sick. I guess all you IMers are just better than most in the world. (I know not everyone is saying this...) Get over it -- if anything, this thread reveals how many ridiculous stereotypes people have here. I'm afraid you're not even close to being true intellectual, progressive elites; though perhaps by the narrow-minded standards of the internet you may have convinced yourself otherwise. Anyway, to our friend from the Netherlands who started this absurd discussion in response to a benign OP, in a blatant example of male-only subjectivity (there's a book called The Second Sex you may want to read), you have conveniently ignored one of the primary elements of cross-cultural elements of western-asian relationships. That is, many asian women get to escape a patriarchal, sexist culture where they have little freedom and protection and marry into a culture that has far more (though not perfect) gender equality. What this has to do with India is unclear, since the Western-Indian intermarriage rate is (likely) relatively low. Heck, first generation American-Indians are still entering into arranged marriages, forget about marrying non-Indians. If this starts a flame war, good, since maybe this thread will be shut down...

Oct 14th, 2005, 10:31	#49
cyberhippie Account Closed by User's Request Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: the Netherlands Posts: 6,014	Raos (I've got my mod hat on now) I'm not entirely sure what got you so upset about this thread but try and keep above the belt!!! You can state your views like anyone else and they will listened to just like any other opinions stated here. Then people will go away and decide for themselves what's right and wrong!! You can't change the world on a public forum, laying out your thoughts is the best you can do!! Ok carry on............and keep it polite please!!

Oct 14th, 2005, 12:25	#56
hey_namaste Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: USA Posts: 30	haha yeah, texas. sometimes i let it slip. hehe. my indian boyfriend even says it sometimes... i guess he's pretty much adapted to texan culture. hehe.

Oct 14th, 2005, 14:18	#59
Ravibagal Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: India Posts: 83	I have many Indian friends who have married white females including my brother. Most of their marriages broke up after 10-12 years as the white females tend to age very badly and the Indian guys seem to have no problem getting younger women or have no problem cheating on their spouses. I think most Indians or Asians in general do not age as badly as the caucasians. A 30 year old Caucasian woman looks like 50+ when compared to an Asian or an Indian. Most guys do not want to look like he's with Grandma. Sad but true...looks do matter. Many Indians marry white females for either a Passport or to show off but after a while they get tired of the relationship for different reasons.

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